standalone help! mustang supercoupe swap! :eek:

38mustang

Registered User
Was wondering if anyone could help me! I have a WOLF EMS standalone system and was wondering if anyone had some helpful suggestions for timing map? I have a fully built supercoupe motor setup swapped into a 1995 mustang. Here are some pics of the build and pic of my timing map from my software.

(Neutral balanced motor)
8.8:1 CR Wiseco forged pistons
Eagle 5.956 I-beam rods
99 3.8 block
2001 crankshaft
Neutral billet steel balancer and aluminum flywheel
1.7 Stud mount rocker arm kit
1.85/1.55 stainless steel valves
Windage tray
CompCams 218/224 .51/.51 112 Billet cam
Set Manley retainers and Crane locks
1.85/1.55 stainless steel valves
Ported heads and intake manifold
Eaton m90 roots blower with custom made raised top, aluminum piping and front mount intercooler
(15-20 psi of boost) 20% OVERDRIVE not sure what psi its going to run..
60 lbs injectors
Adjustable fuel regulator with rail mounted gauge
255 fuel pump
Tremec TKO tranny 5spd
Long tube headers (modified)
Custom made Stainless w spin tech mufflers side exhaust
85 mm throttle body with modified supercharger plenum.
Plx wide band.
LS2 coil packs & 8.8 MSD wires
Wolf ems version 4.72
New 8.8 rear end w 3.73 gears posi
aluminum drive shaft

probably more….

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Thanks everyone! help would be great! :D
 
Try the tuning forum....Nice work on the car by the way...There are very few people on here that will be able to help you. Especially with stand alone.
 
The V6 power guys are mostly tuners and centrifugals and not that knowledgeable on the M90 setups.
 
He's a newbie so he doesn't have access to the tuning forumn.

38Mustang,

Great effort on the project. Looks awesome. Try Frasier (fturner) or Dave Dalke (XR7Dave). Dave tunes SC's and Frasier is really into the chip and software aspect of the game.
 
Thanks everyone! I put alot of work into this car. 5 years to be exact and two motors. Wish I could get on the tuner forum... not sure if i want to pay for the membership though. Anymore suggestions would be great!
 
re

You spent all that time and money just take it to a good shop spend $300 have it tunned and don't F with it. Trust me been down that road.



Good luck with it sweet setup.
 
The last set up I had 2 shops try and tune this thing and they did a horrible job. I just ended up changing everything. A/F ratios lean as hell and timing was way to conservative. we are talking 15 degrees at WOT. They toasted my tranny and i believe they are the reason why I had to rebuild the motor. You are right though, I want it done right. just want to know what you guys run for timing? Wot 17 psi boost 21 degrees? low load 30 degrees?

I just have a hard time passing my car off to anyone...
 
If I was tuning your car I'd start with about 17 degrees timing max at the top end and double check the AFR targetting 11.7.

What you need I think if I can read that chart right is to start with the borderline spark table off of a 94/95 SC but keep the upper load and rpm spark a couple of degrees lower like I mentioned above. Your motor will probably behave similar to a stock SC at part throttle etc.

You need to get the car on a dyno and start working the timing up.

What MAF are you running or are you running the car as speed density? Just curious why the car would lean out.

Fraser
 
I am running a 2 bar map, crank, TPS, IAC, Watertemp, and air temp sensor. waste spark with bank injection.... It ran lean because the fuel map was not correct... I agree with the 17 degrees for a start point. I will remap that:) thanks.
 
Do any of you guys have that borderline spark table?

O and just to explain my map a little bit... the X axis is based of load % via map sensor. Basically i have it programmed so that 100% load would be 20 psi... 35% load would be like 12 psi and so on. Y axis is just rpm.

Thanks for all the help BTW:D
 
I can take a snapshot of it when I get home after work if someone doesn't post it up before then.

It sounds like your fuel mapping is along the lines of speed density instead of MAF which is based on load and rpm. In some ways its suppose to be easier to tune, but in other ways it can become a major pain. For your load%, you need to know if 100% load is going to be a full boost (less likely), or is it setup that when you enter boost the car will be going over 100% load (more likely). Typically with a roots style blower your going to see over 100% (for instance my car hits about 137% load at around 3200rpm's at around 15psi) and slowly drops from there as it revs higher. Also, anytime even at idle that motor will have load, say maybe around 15% and if it was N/A you could see 70% load at WOT.

I can only speculate because I'm not familiar with that wolf system.

Slowly work your car up into higher load and rpm datalogging everything along the way.... but keep the higher stuff on the safe side till your there.

Fraser
 
Part of your problem is the way you set up the map vs. your MAP sensor. A 2 bar MAP will read a maximum of 14.7 PSI absolute boost. This means that it is unable to read anything above that. If you're running higher boost, you need a 3 bar MAP sensor for your system. Yes, you will lose some resolution, but there's really no way around it. I would probably use the low altitude timing map just because it will be less aggressive than the high altitude timing map. Remember that speed density does not need to compensate for altitude since you're inferring the air mass from the MAP sensor.
 
Jay, I don't know where you got those timing maps but that is screwed up. An SC will hardly run with those lower timing maps. The Base map is the only one that is any good and it is pretty close although it has no resolution above 105% load. For max timing under boost start at 16 deg and work up from there. Most likely it will want at least 20 deg to make any power. Not sure if pump gas will work out for you at your boost level though.

Ghost is right, you have to run a 3bar MAP and scale everything for your maximum intended boost level. An SC motor will generate no more than 70% load at 0 boost so use that to determine your preferred AFR and timing maps. When you install the 3 Bar map sensor, be sure to properly scale your tables. You'll need the transfer function for whatever sensor you end up using.

Too bad you jumped ship and went to an aftermarket EMS. The Ford system is so much easier. Mike Tuck has the same system though, so he may be able to give you some tips on setting it up.
 
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