Sorry, another brake thread

sc91gt

Registered User
Hello, I have reeeedone all the suspension. The exhaust, and all the motor upgrades I want to do. So now the brakes. I have searched and there is just too much filler and nothing directly related. I want to upgrade the brakes to the sport package.? What years can I get parts from? I want to do stainless lines slotted and drilled rotors but need to know what year/size to order. I have learned I will need 93 up spindles and end links. If you guys could be so kind to list what parts I will need from the yr/models to get these parts that would be awesome. Or a link to a port that covers this. Thanks in advance, Shawn.
 
OK so you have 3 options that I know of the only sport brakes that I know are bigger on birds is on the 97 sport. You also have the mustang twin piston calipers that come on 99 to 04 mustangs. Your other option is 13 inch brakes form the mustang cobra.
 
OK so you have 3 options that I know of the only sport brakes that I know are bigger on birds is on the 97 sport.


Or, any Mark VIII.

OTOH, if you grab 15" spindles (non-Sport), you can use the PBR upgrade.

Which fits the rotors for the non-Sport front end, and still clamp better and stop better than the Sports do, from most reports (there's a few reports of otherwise, so YMMV, natch.)

But yah, I'd grab some Mark VIII spindles, and use the calipers and rotors (and the swaybar end links!) from any Mark VIII.

Consider that a good time to replace the front wheel bearings (hub and all).

RwP
 
I have an awesome set of 20x9 20x10 wheels in the bird bolt pattern. I sold some pbr/brembo set up for this reason. I just want a budget, same bolt pattern upgrade. I want o get parts rotors,lines, calipers, and need to know wich years. Gonna do a junkyard run tomorrow for spindles and what not. ??
 
Cool, that is what i want. Same bolt pattern. New wheel bearings for sure.
Or, any Mark VIII.

OTOH, if you grab 15" spindles (non-Sport), you can use the PBR upgrade.

Which fits the rotors for the non-Sport front end, and still clamp better and stop better than the Sports do, from most reports (there's a few reports of otherwise, so YMMV, natch.)

But yah, I'd grab some Mark VIII spindles, and use the calipers and rotors (and the swaybar end links!) from any Mark VIII.

Consider that a good time to replace the front wheel bearings (hub and all).

RwP
 
What? So what is the best caliper,rotor,spindle combo for bird bolt pattern? So the PBR calipers will work with the bird brackets and rotors?
 
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I did 13 inch baer brakes with spindles from a mark 8 added mustand hubs which slide right on the mark 8 spindle and had mt rear hubs re drilled by stu spencer in the mustang pattern and have a tone of wheel choices now. 5x4.25 has a very narrow selectionhere is mine
baer4.jpg

rearend.jpg

spindlefront.jpg

cobraconv3-1.jpg
 
Or, any Mark VIII.

OTOH, if you grab 15" spindles (non-Sport), you can use the PBR upgrade.

Which fits the rotors for the non-Sport front end, and still clamp better and stop better than the Sports do, from most reports (there's a few reports of otherwise, so YMMV, natch.)

But yah, I'd grab some Mark VIII spindles, and use the calipers and rotors (and the swaybar end links!) from any Mark VIII.

Consider that a good time to replace the front wheel bearings (hub and all).

RwP

What's a 15in spindle? The pbr's should work on any spindle 93 and up with stock rotors.
 
cornfused

So, my bird is a 90, are all 93 up spindles the same, bird and markv111? I am off to the junkyard for some spindles and possibly calipers if I find any good ones. What about 93 up rear brakes? Any better? I just want "budget better" and keep my wheels. I will grab an extra set of hubs to have drilled in the mustang pattern for the future maybe.
 
So, my bird is a 90, are all 93 up spindles the same, bird and markv111? I am off to the junkyard for some spindles and possibly calipers if I find any good ones. What about 93 up rear brakes? Any better? I just want "budget better" and keep my wheels. I will grab an extra set of hubs to have drilled in the mustang pattern for the future maybe.

To do any front brake upgrade, you'll have to swap to the 93 and up spindles and sway bar endlinks (t-bird or mark viii - same spindles). If you're keeping the stock 16in wheels, your only options are PBR's with the stock t-bird rotors or the Mark viii/t-bird sport front brakes (larger rotors and different calipers). Also, if you plan on retaining the ABS, make sure the spindles are from an ABS car.

As far as the rears, they are pretty much the same throughout the years aside from a few small changes.
 
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What's a 15in spindle? The pbr's should work on any spindle 93 and up with stock rotors.

The caliper brackets labeled "15" are stock - the ones labeled "16" are Sport and/or Mark VIII. I should have said '15" spindle assembly' to distinguish between those and the ones that require 16" wheels better.

To the OP - the PBR upgrade requires new brackets, but amazingly, RockAuto sells from several suppliers that supply brackets WITH the calipers (fancy that!) and also list the brackets as a separate line item.

For the early 200x GT / V6 Mustangs, that is.

They fit a standard rotor for the Thunderbird/Cougar from 93 to 97.

Caveat: Get the banjo bolt (or stick with the 2004!) since several years of the compatible calipers used a different banjo bolt thread.

As to the SPINDLES, yes, they are the same (Mark VIII and 1993-1997 TBird/Cougar). The calipers and the caliper BRACKETS change, as do the rotors, with the Mark VIII and the TBird/Cougar Sport requiring 16" wheels to clear (but being interchangeable), the TBird/Cougar non-Sport clearing 15" wheels.

The Baer 13" usually requires a 17" or 18" wheel to clear (there's some 16" that will clear.) No arguement, that's a better brake, although it also will require either redrilling the rotors to fit the Tbird/Cougar/MarkVIII pattern, or replacing the hubs with Mustang ones (the proper ones are here in posts, or can be found at TCCoA's forums, and since I'm not headed that way, I don't have the proper years memorized.) The question is, is it enough better to be worth the money and pain? Besides, to do that, you'll need a set of 93+ spindles ANYWAY - I'd grab Sport/Mark VIII spindle sets, put those on, and be saving for the Baer. Or the PBR (get new rotors when you move to PBR, so they'll fit). Or even go Mark VIII (oops! Need moar brakes!), PBR (Better, not good enough), and then Baer :D Step at a time as you have money. Reselling all the stuff you DON'T use, natch!

If you're doing a Sport upgrade, and it's a U-Pull-It, grab the handicap spare out of the Mark or TBird/Cougar so you'll have a spare that'll clear for JustInCase. Or even if it's NOT a Sport set, grab a Mark VIII handicap spare so you have one, again for that Case fellow (JustIn Case, you know him?)

(I'd also have that chunk of rubber replaced- 20 year old tires ARE known to suffer from dry-rot ... )

RwP
 
First of all, thank you for the quick responses and info!:) As stated just want better factory sourced brakes and I have 20" wheels so clearance is not an issue. Last question "hopefully", so with the sport brakes, spindles and slightly larger rotors, I can bolt on the pbr calipers up? Or need to stay with the "sport calipers? I would like the slightly larger rotors, but if the pbr/standard rotor combo offers better braking performance then that is what I will do. Thanks again.
 
You can only use the PBR calipers/bracket with the stock rotors. Mark VIII/T-bird sport rotors require the Mark VIII/T-bird sport caliper/bracket.
 
You can only use the PBR calipers/bracket with the stock rotors. Mark VIII/T-bird sport rotors require the Mark VIII/T-bird sport caliper/bracket.

Well, to add to it - if he goes Mark VIII now, and decides to go PBR, he'll have to buy new rotors.

Which I tend to do new rotors every time I do brakes ANYWAY - I have to remind myself that not everyone does that :eek:

I'd do new rotors in any case, for JustIn Case (you know that guy, don't you?)

RwP
 
I put R1 racing concepts slotted/drilled rotors on my stang and love them. So that is part of the reason for this thread, so I can order the right ones for my application. Which is better as far as stopping power, PBR's or Mark VIII set up? I'm leaning towards PBR's, but the junkyard has a 93 mark sitting there.
 
I put R1 racing concepts slotted/drilled rotors on my stang and love them. So that is part of the reason for this thread, so I can order the right ones for my application. Which is better as far as stopping power, PBR's or Mark VIII set up? I'm leaning towards PBR's, but the junkyard has a 93 mark sitting there.

The math says PBRs, but there's folks that swear the Mark VIII/Sport setup is better.

Do consider that since PBRs require using a new caliper bracket, all you would be out would be the rotors if you grab the Mark VIII set and switch to PBRs later. And they're not that much for OEM style - RockAuto has Sport rotors for as little as $25 plus shipping. standard for $23 plus shipping each. At that price, I'd heavily consider doing the Mark VIII now (since you'll have to spend at least $90 for new sway bar end links of acceptable quality) and PBR if you decide to later.

Now for a big hint: If you have ABS, you'll have to grab the ABS sensors also, and adapt the wiring. But if you DO have ABS, and your car goes into ABS on heavy braking, better brakes ain't the answer :D Just had to point that out in case you're thinking it does (NonABS, if you're locking the wheels and sliding, then more brakes won't help there either.)

RwP
 
Cool Thanks. I am use to hossing my modded mustang with no abs, so no worries there. Suspenion been redone, I put ssbc rear disc conv on it aswell as upgraded the front too. The thing will plant u into the window! With the nitto nt05s on it I can get quite a bit of stopping before lockup and its predictable.

So same philosophy on the bird. Suspension has been gone through and improved, now the brakes. Since I have put good tires on it I dont think Ive hit the abs once during hard braking. The nankangs I replaced would squeal and try to lock up if u looked at them funny. Also I am going to convert it to conventional brakes at the same time while doing the lines and calipers ect..
 
If converting to conventional, then you don't have to worry about the ABS.

Check my posts on what I used so I didn't have to replumb the brakes (the 1991-1993 TBird master cylinder is available with no proportioning valves on the MC, so all you need is to change one fitting and use one brake bleeder, and it'll fit perfect to the two front wheel lines. Use the booster for your year car, and you should be golden.)

Or even better, replumb the lines to the back and get the diagonal braking going on, but you'll have to get the proportioning valves out of the boneyard (haven't found ANYONE who sells them ... if you do, PLEASE post it here!)

RwP
 
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