maybe i messed up my timing

TBirdSC89

TBirdSC89

Registered User
since i was under pressure to have a working car i replaced the front cover gasket cause of a leak, I didn't take the cam housing out of the cover and made sure not to move it. Not sure if I need to now adjust the cam timing since the car won't start, in which case I need to take the timing cover off again? Not sure if it's adjustable just by taking the sensor off and using the alignment tool, I've really looked into this but if I don't need to take the cover off that would be great. If I do not need to adjust the timing than I'm gonna check the crank sensor and make sure it's right. any inout is greatly appreciated thanks
Ryan
 
TBirdSC89 said:
since i was under pressure to have a working car i replaced the front cover gasket cause of a leak, I didn't take the cam housing out of the cover and made sure not to move it. Not sure if I need to now adjust the cam timing since the car won't start, in which case I need to take the timing cover off again? Not sure if it's adjustable just by taking the sensor off and using the alignment tool, I've really looked into this but if I don't need to take the cover off that would be great. If I do not need to adjust the timing than I'm gonna check the crank sensor and make sure it's right. any inout is greatly appreciated thanks
Ryan
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Do you mean you pulled the timing cover off whiteout removing the cam sensor and shaft assembly?
 
Hey
Yea I ust pulled the timing cover replaced the gasket. I didn't pull out any of the assembly but did take off the sensor on top, the black part with the 2 bolts. Just not sure if I did those things that I still gotta adjust the timing with or without removing the timing cover again
 
Well ... the gear on the end of the cam sensor has to mesh with the cam gear, right? They need to be lined up properly. I don't see how you could guarantee that the gear on the cam sensor didn't rotate at all when removing and reinstalling it. So I would say you need to re-time it. Try unplugging the cam sensor and then starting it. It may take more tries than usual, but it should run right. (Make sure that the wires won't contact the belt after the engine starts.) If it starts without the cam sensor, then it's timed wrong.

Re-timing it consists of pulling the housing out of the timing cover and re-inserting it in the proper position, after moving the engine to TDC #1 compression stroke.
 
I'm gonna try the cam sensor unhook trick, but also I do realize that the cam most likely moved especially if I pulled the timing cover. I guess if it is off and I had to pull everything apart again it won't take as long, i'm getting good practice at doing this
 
cam sensor unhooked tried key on key off 6 times and nothing. took a pic of the crank sensor it looks good to me but maybe it's off a little? got no upshift light when trying to start. im just gonna go over everything and double check everything to make sure im not missin nothing
 

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Really

There is a cam gear which drives the cam position sensor housing. I don't see how you can do that not ensuring the the oil pump drive is still connected other than that the oil pump and cam position sensor are both in the timing cover.
My first thought was that was all messed up but I see it now. Just pull the cam sensor drive and time it wiht the engine positioned as described in the manual.
 
ill try that thanks gr8ghost. now that i look at the crank sensor the rear slot isnt passing thru the sensor..either i didnt put it on right or didnt install the damper far enough arggggg
 
TBirdSC89 said:
ill try that thanks gr8ghost. now that i look at the crank sensor the rear slot isnt passing thru the sensor..either i didnt put it on right or didnt install the damper far enough arggggg
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It looks fine, that is an air gap that isn't supposed to pass through the sensor.

You just need to set the motor to 26 degrees After TDC "zero" on the compression stroke for cyl #1, then pull the scyncro stalk and reinstall it using the alignment tool. Do a search for pictures.

David
 
TBirdSC89 said:
cam sensor unhooked tried key on key off 6 times and nothing. took a pic of the crank sensor it looks good to me but maybe it's off a little? got no upshift light when trying to start. im just gonna go over everything and double check everything to make sure im not missin nothing
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You're saying that the car wouldn't start with the cam sensor unhooked?

If so, let's go back to basics. What is missing here, spark or fuel?

- Do you smell gas after it fails to start?

- If you pull one of the plug boots off the coil pack and leave it a short distance away (~1/2"), does it spark?
 
Btw - I had no idea you could pull a timing cover with the cam sensor housing still in place. :eek: I wouldn't have even thought of trying that. I would just assume that either the cam gear or cam sensor gear would snap.
 
90sc35thann said:
Btw - I had no idea you could pull a timing cover with the cam sensor housing still in place. :eek: I wouldn't have even thought of trying that. I would just assume that either the cam gear or cam sensor gear would snap.
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I think the cam sensor gear would turn as you pulled the cover off, which is why I think the cam sensor timing has to be a guess now. But if the cam sensor is unplugged, the car should be able to run. Waiting for the OP to come back and explain if it runs now or not.
 
S_Mazza said:
I think the cam sensor gear would turn as you pulled the cover off, which is why I think the cam sensor timing has to be a guess now. But if the cam sensor is unplugged, the car should be able to run. Waiting for the OP to come back and explain if it runs now or not.
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For sure. I totally agree.
 
Not starting still. Got no spark from coil pack and I need to get a fuel pressure gauge to hook up while I key on key off. I got fuel to the rail when key is on. If the timing is off that wouldn't make spark or fuel would it? Car was running rough before the oil leak, if a pump or valve inside the cover went out that wouldn't affect it would it? Still ran fine with no oil pressure but I started it to check the pressure and shut it off within 5 seconds to avoid engine damage
 
I'm thinking the timing is off and it moved when uninstall install the cover. Like David said I prob did that
 
TBirdSC89 said:
I'm thinking the timing is off and it moved when uninstall install the cover. Like David said I prob did that
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It would still start with the cam sensor unplugged after a few attempts. Did you replace the timing chain while you had the cover off?
 
Didn't take timing chain off or replace anything just replaced the all the gaskets I needed. I tried starting without the cam sensor hooked up prob a dozen times. I'm sorry if I'm killing anyone's time with all this, these cars are just fairly complicated still to me
 
If you have no spark, it's most likely either the crank sensor or some wiring to the ignition or EEC. I would check the engine harness really carefully. You can also test the crank sensor. The procedure is on here somewhere.
 
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