AOD 6 direct raybestos set up ?

Miguel5671

Miguel5671

Registered User
i searched and didnt find anything about this hope someone can help out or give me their opinion

so im in the process of putting together my transmission and im using raybestos blue clutches i had two full packs (that i got for free )
but im not doing neither of the stock nor alto set up
alto uses 7-8 clutches on the stamped steel drum
and stock or raybestos pack uses 5
i was able to fit 6 raybestos blues on direct without having play it actually fit very good

has anyone else tried this set up ?? im i totally going to mess it up or will it work ?
i mean people do the 7-8 clutch set up on the thin red altos
why not 6 ? all it is its the thickness and specs isnt it ? or is there another difference i am not aware of ?

as well as the intermediate instead of 3 im using 4 of course raybestos blue not altos i had to change the steels set up a bit im using all kolene steels i got a bunch of different thicknesses and its why im testing this out

will this come haunt me later on ?

has anyone used the raybestos like this ?
i dont want to close it all up and mount it i want to be sure this might work
i used the altos before and i used the raybestos
i like how raybestos are the hardest grabbing but i guess thats just preference on my opinion that is why i opted going on blues again
btw its an AOD
 
Miguel5671 said:
i mean people do the 7-8 clutch set up on the thin red altos
why not 6 ? all it is its the thickness and specs isnt it ? or is there another difference i am not aware of ?

as well as the intermediate instead of 3 im using 4 of course raybestos blue not altos i had to change the steels set up a bit im using all kolene steels i got a bunch of different thicknesses and its why im testing this out
Click to expand...
The stock SC iron direct drum uses 6 frictions and 6 steels. The more plates and frictions you can fit, the better as it increases the clutch surface. As long as you can get adequate clearances, it shouldnt cause any problem. The drum is suppose to have a small air gap according to Haynes book but you have a range to work with with different thickness snap rings to get it.
 
TbirdSCFan said:
The stock SC iron direct drum uses 6 frictions and 6 steels. The more plates and frictions you can fit, the better as it increases the clutch surface. As long as you can get adequate clearances, it shouldnt cause any problem. The drum is suppose to have a small air gap according to Haynes book but you have a range to work with with different thickness snap rings to get it.
Click to expand...

really ? when i first opened mine last december had 5 and 5
and the raybestos AOD pack came only with 5 to use
, maybe the set was a for a cast drum or does it make no difference ?
but since i had two packs i used a clutch from the other pack
i did have to change the steels a tad bit
so the clearance ended up almost identical. so then it shouldnt have a problem as long as its the same clearance as the stock specs? :D
 
Miguel5671 said:
really ? when i first opened mine last december had 5 and 5
and the raybestos AOD pack came only with 5 to use
, maybe the set was a for a cast drum or does it make no difference ?
but since i had two packs i used a clutch from the other pack
i did have to change the steels a tad bit
so the clearance ended up almost identical. so then it shouldnt have a problem as long as its the same clearance as the stock specs? :D
Click to expand...
On second and third thought, now I'm not so sure. I recall the reverse drum has 4 (same friction size as the forward), the forward has 5, and the direct had 6.
I rebuilt one with the alto's so that may be whats stuck in my head. It failed soon after for another reason (a loose 2-3 accumulator piston) and at the time I thought the thinner clutch frictions was the reason. So in hindsite, the denser packing was probably just fine.. not just fine, but better actually.
As long as you can pack them in there and its not too tight or too loose, you're better off.
Be sure to check the fit of the 2-3 accumulator piston :D It should be snug.. mine could be removed by hand. Not any more, but at the time. :rolleyes:
 
TbirdSCFan said:
On second and third thought, now I'm not so sure. I recall the reverse drum has 4 (same friction size as the forward), the forward has 5, and the direct had 6.
I rebuilt one with the alto's so that may be whats stuck in my head. It failed soon after for another reason (a loose 2-3 accumulator piston) and at the time I thought the thinner clutch frictions was the reason. So in hindsite, the denser packing was probably just fine.. not just fine, but better actually.
As long as you can pack them in there and its not too tight or too loose, you're better off.
Be sure to check the fit of the 2-3 accumulator piston :D It should be snug.. mine could be removed by hand. Not any more, but at the time. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

yes reverse i kept 4
forward i fit 6 as well
and direct 6
intermediate 4
well clearance seems to be just fine hopefully it works better

:rolleyes: im a little too late on that advise :(
this is the second rebuild
my 2-3 accum piston was cracked and i snapped the direct drive shaft
intermediate clutches ended up polished :eek:
so now more clutches wider band some aode guts
hardened shaft and rubber bonded accum piston :D hope this holds up
 
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Update

so i have not yet finished this thing due to some ugly weather here

first i followed alan's (dirty dog performance) and Dan's ( silverfox ) tips and suggestions as to how to build this aod
i thank them so much for all the help

i decided not to get sloppy and realized that building a trans that could hold good amount of power wouldnt hurt even if my junk isnt near 300hp yet i thought about it twice and i dont want to take this thing down again in quite a while

so i went ahead and added the AODE stamped steel reverse drum
AODE sun shell
that to be able to upgrade to the 2" high energy band
i upgraded my cast direct drum to a stamped steel drum got it hardened to prevent twisting it thats why the extra clutch was able to work there
i used the AODE 4 clutch set up with 3 .069 steels and one .077
and was able to get good clearance there
i also upgraded my output shaft to a 93 mark 8 shaft supposedly the best replacement
i went ahead and got a 300m direct drive shaft
i stacked 6 fwd clutches drilled a .05 hole on the fwd piston to reduce the harsh 4-3 kickdowns
i checked and revised the valve body guy who originally added the shift kit
made a few sloppy mistakes
also i added the transgo hi rev valve as it seemed i had a stock gov valve there guy didnt add my high rev valve in the beginning
added a sonnax boost valve
sonnax a+ servo
updated rubber bonded 2-3 accumulator
did a few lube mods

the only thing i didnt change was to go to a one piece shaft
because i would need another converter and i ran out of budget for this

i hope this will hold for a while

because as of now this aod has cost me what a lentech would -.- with alot more hassle

didnt get many pics but i got these two will look for more later
 
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TbirdSCFan said:
On second and third thought, now I'm not so sure. I recall the reverse drum has 4 (same friction size as the forward), the forward has 5, and the direct had 6.
I rebuilt one with the alto's so that may be whats stuck in my head. It failed soon after for another reason (a loose 2-3 accumulator piston) and at the time I thought the thinner clutch frictions was the reason. So in hindsite, the denser packing was probably just fine.. not just fine, but better actually.
As long as you can pack them in there and its not too tight or too loose, you're better off.
Be sure to check the fit of the 2-3 accumulator piston :D It should be snug.. mine could be removed by hand. Not any more, but at the time. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

btw you were right mate my mistake
it does fit 6 with the stamped drum
and 5 with the cast
i was able to fit 6 on my cast with a diff snap ring its why i thought i had an extra clutch but now 6 is normal with the stamped steel :)
 
TbirdSCFan said:
That generally how it works out. :rolleyes: It starts with that phrase "while Im at it, I might as well..."
Click to expand...

i had a bad feeling and opened it again found a broken bearing two pieces were in the direct drum

thank god it rained and i didnt install my trans

but im getting the final clearance of .07 i think it may be too much :/
i hear clearance should be no less than .005 but no more than .01 per clutch
times 6 clutches i should get .03-.06??



******had to upload the pics on this one it wouldn't let me post for some reason********
 
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ok so i finished got all my clearances up to spec
and everything looks good

except that transtec gasket i have to trim it down a bit to work perfectly or get a diff gasket that is the actual size

Here are some pics
 
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Miguel5671 said:
the only thing i didnt change was to go to a one piece shaft
because i would need another converter and i ran out of budget for this
Click to expand...


One piece input shaft isn't necessary until get to about 500 HP. Just run a non-direct drive converter and you will be good till you get to about that HP level. I run a heavily modified (most every mod you have done) AOD behind a Ford Racing crate 392 stroker in my 69 Cougar producing about 430hp/450lb-ft torque through a Lentec level 3 valve body, 9 1/2" non direct drive lentec converter, and I havent broken the shaft. I did break the input shaft in my SC at about 250 rear wheel hp with the 12" direct drive Daco converter.... not cool. I never liked the way a stock AOD with the direct drive converter shifted 3-4 or 4-3. Installed a non-direct drive converter and problem solved.

Bryan
 
Sweet then it should hold up on my sc im no where near high hp I think my sc is at about that lvl 240-250rwhp and I do have a dacco converter as well maybe that was the problem
I hope to change it soon as I can as well as getting an upgraded valve body

So it would be a lock up converter without the direct drive ? Or just the non lock type?
 
Miguel5671 said:
So it would be a lock up converter without the direct drive ? Or just the non lock type?
Click to expand...

The AOD converter is not a "Lock Up" converter. They don't have that feature. True lock up converters didn't come along until the 4R70W version. The AOD converter is a direct drive setup for 3rd and 4th gears. The center input shaft fits into a splined hub welded to the converter case and turns at the same RPM as the engine crankshaft. When you go with an "Open" type AOD converter you lose the direct drive feature but gain torque multiplication for 3rd gear. At the same time you will lose about 1 MPG of fuel efficiency with an open type converter but gain a little ET in the 1/4 mile.

Bryan
 
SuperChicken89 said:
The AOD converter is not a "Lock Up" converter. They don't have that feature. True lock up converters didn't come along until the 4R70W version. The AOD converter is a direct drive setup for 3rd and 4th gears. The center input shaft fits into a splined hub welded to the converter case and turns at the same RPM as the engine crankshaft. When you go with an "Open" type AOD converter you lose the direct drive feature but gain torque multiplication for 3rd gear. At the same time you will lose about 1 MPG of fuel efficiency with an open type converter but gain a little ET in the 1/4 mile.

Bryan
Click to expand...

Got it so I can keep my 2 shaft set up and run an open converter to delete the nasty 3-4 ,4-3
I think I can live with a little loss on mileage
So u are running hardened direct shaft and hardened outputshaft on yours
 
hoped for the best expected the worst...

Got the transmission on there set the right tv pressure

test drive..... TOTAL SUCCES :D

i LOVE this thing now

it hauls ~~~ it performed better than i expected it to do so :)


leaves rubber 1st-2nd and even 2nd-3rd it squeals and wants to go sideways

shifts at mid throttle are pretty good firm no harsh

i dont have a harsh 4-3 kick down with the 6 fwd clutches

downshifts happen in a snap when i want them to

manual shifting is awesome i can hold 1st 2nd and 3rd till whatever i want
other wise it shifts auto at WOT 1st-2nd at 5400rpm
2nd - 3rd 5000-5100rpm

at light throttle it doesnt even feel like it would be such a monster at WOT shifts very happy with it

i was able to stall till 2700rpm which seems pretty good for street

i was ~~~~ting bricks thinking something was going to go wrong but no :)
very happy with my results

thanks for all the help and tips guys really appreciate it
 
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