11sec combos

sarge103rd

Registered User
probably been discussed a bunch of times but I couldn't find much just kinda looking for some of your guys combos that have made it into the 11's. just trying to get a rough blue print of the direction in mods I need to go.
 
You'll need to do all the same type of things you'd expect to do to what was a 15 sec car to get it into the 11's. Most of the drivetrain may or may not hold up. Lot of people run stock parts until they break and then upgrade. Pick your poison, but if you upgrade everything first then you'll have to expect it to be prohibitively expensive.

In simple terms you'll need generally 400rwhp, how you get there is up to you. Some people have made it into the 11's with less than 400rwhp, but usually that means lightening the car and a bunch of trial and error + practice and experimentation to make up for the HP deficit.

Your AOD will probably only hold about 300rwhp before it goes south so count on upgrading that. Other drivetrain parts are kind of hit or miss as to whether or not things hold together into the 11's.

You aren't really going to get a recipe because of all the 11 second SC's out there, no one has followed the same path.
 
You'll need to do all the same type of things you'd expect to do to what was a 15 sec car to get it into the 11's. Most of the drivetrain may or may not hold up. Lot of people run stock parts until they break and then upgrade. Pick your poison, but if you upgrade everything first then you'll have to expect it to be prohibitively expensive.

In simple terms you'll need generally 400rwhp, how you get there is up to you. Some people have made it into the 11's with less than 400rwhp, but usually that means lightening the car and a bunch of trial and error + practice and experimentation to make up for the HP deficit.

Your AOD will probably only hold about 300rwhp before it goes south so count on upgrading that. Other drivetrain parts are kind of hit or miss as to whether or not things hold together into the 11's.

You aren't really going to get a recipe because of all the 11 second SC's out there, no one has followed the same path.

Well the sc i picked up has a tapping in the motor, so I figured that's going to have to be torn down, so while I'm at it I was going to do the generic mods like heads cam bore it out. And I've delt with roots style blowers before but never on anything less than a v8. I guess I'll just start at the bottom with whatever suspension and chassis m9ds that are out there for this platform, and then work through the power train and power adder options.
 
If you were interested in a turbo setup a 57-60mm turbo setup will blow enough wind to get you there.
 
If you did build your AOD, don't forget the mechanical diode. Cheapest way is to get a 4R70 from the junkyard and use the parts that ATSG directs to. If you want the pages that tell you what to do, if you build your trans, pm me. More than any other reason, the best is that you drop 10 lbs from the transmission.
 
The one item that everyone has upgraded to is a twin screw supercharger as mentioned, Autorotor, Whipple, Kenne Bell or TVS. A couple have dipped into the 11's with an MPx. For most this has been supported by larger injectors/mafs/tb, cam, forged internals, big valve ported heads, upgraded fuel systems,front mounted intercoolers, Moates QH chip/tune and I'm not listing everything. I ran consistent low 11's with a MPx and 100 shot of nitrous for years, I now have a 2.3 Whipple still with nitrous but haven't made it to the track.........or anywhere else............:(
 
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If you are serious (seems that you are) then there are several things to consider.

The 3.8L bottom end will handle the power level necessary to get into the 11's in most cases. The only thing is that the stock rods and pistons do not offer much of a margin of safety in the event that tuning goes wrong (and usually it does at some point or another). Aftermarket rods and pistons won't guarantee anything, but it will definitely increase your safety margin.

Heads and cam are pretty much an absolute requirement unless you plan to use a lot of nitrous, but most likely the stock pistons wont' hold up to the 150 shot that would be required so again, heads/cam required.

If re-doing the bottom end and not planning to use nitrous, then a 4.2L stroker kit is a big plus. It helps efficiency in other ways that just the displacement increase. The resulting package will be more detonation resistant and the longer stroke helps overcome the lack of cylinder head flow (even with ported heads). The cost increase for a 4.2L over a 3.8L is minimal.

You are going to need a fuel and engine management hardware/software capable of supporting the power level. To run 11's you can rely on an in tank pump and 80lb injectors, matching MAF, and associated intake hardware. You'll need to tune it and being you are in CT, you might want to hit up some of the local members when the time comes. There are some really fast SC's with properly qualified owners who can help you with that when you are ready for that. The stock EEC will handle the job without difficulty, but you will have to run a piggy back tuner known around here as the "Quarterhorse". It is fully programmable and provides real time data acquisition and live updating.

You have some choices for induction. As mentioned above, a fully kitted out M90 can get you there if you want to go that route. My biggest issue with this route is that the blower is small and requires tons of overdrive to get the job done. Reliability and consistency become an issue due to the fact that the blower is simply being asked to do something it was never designed to do.

An aftermarket blower that sits on top of the motor (Whipple, TVS, KB, etc.) can definitely get the job done too but there is no commercially available kit to do so. It's going to be custom with lots of complex fabrication.

Turbo is a great option too if you want to do it yourself and have some abilities (you'll have to make your own hot and cold sides), particularly if you are going to use the automatic and even more so if you trade the AOD in for a C4 with trans brake. In this case 11's would be a low side goal and 10's would be within reach.

I've built many high HP engines for people on this board, I am an independent engine builder who specializes in the 3.8/4.2L V6 so if you have any need or interest you can hit me up off the board at the email in my sig. I'm not using this as a selling platform but we will cross paths sooner or later so you may as well know what I do and where I'm coming from with what I say. You can also see some of my shop and projects by clicking the SCUI link in one of the banner ads at the top of this page.
 
Sarge:

I noticed a couple of times you've mentioned "kits" for power adders and I don't think anyone has really answered you on that. There are no kits for our cars, you many find somebody who is selling off a complete custom install that you could bolt on but that's pretty rare around here and they get gobbled up quick. Everything else is 100% custom, be that roots, twin screw or turbo. If you need a builder David Dalke is the leader when it comes to doing these custom installs, he has done many and his parts and knowledge are in virtually every fast SC I know of, otherwise you are on your own to assemble and fabricate your own setup although the specialty parts can be source through David. There is lots of knowledge here that people share freely if you are going down that route but an 11sec SC is not just in the motor, it will take tuning and some time at the track to get the car to consistently run in the 11s.

I am in East Hartford CT if you want to talk sometime.
 
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Wow guys I really appreciate the detailed advice this is exactly what I was looking for. I know that with the unique platform customized setups are the name of the game, but it's kind of a relief that you guys are offering your suggestions and opening up communication so I can pick your brains. I guess the first step Is going to get the car I called uhaul and the earliest I can get a car hauler is Jan 31st. I'm kinda nervous about that too since I've never hauled a car in tow before.
 
Sarge:

I noticed a couple of times you've mentioned "kits" for power adders and I don't think anyone has really answered you on that. There are no kits for our cars, you many find somebody who is selling off a complete custom install that you could bolt on but that's pretty rare around here and they get gobbled up quick. Everything else is 100% custom, be that roots, twin screw or turbo. If you need a builder David Dalke is the leader when it comes to doing these custom installs, he has done many and his parts and knowledge are in virtually every fast SC I know of, otherwise you are on your own to assemble and fabricate your own setup although the specialty parts can be source through David. There is lots of knowledge here that people share freely if you are going down that route but an 11sec SC is not just in the motor, it will take tuning and some time at the track to get the car to consistently run in the 11s.

I am in East Hartford CT if you want to talk sometime.
Where in east hartford are you?
 
If you are serious (seems that you are) then there are several things to consider.

The 3.8L bottom end will handle the power level necessary to get into the 11's in most cases. The only thing is that the stock rods and pistons do not offer much of a margin of safety in the event that tuning goes wrong (and usually it does at some point or another). Aftermarket rods and pistons won't guarantee anything, but it will definitely increase your safety margin.

Heads and cam are pretty much an absolute requirement unless you plan to use a lot of nitrous, but most likely the stock pistons wont' hold up to the 150 shot that would be required so again, heads/cam required.

If re-doing the bottom end and not planning to use nitrous, then a 4.2L stroker kit is a big plus. It helps efficiency in other ways that just the displacement increase. The resulting package will be more detonation resistant and the longer stroke helps overcome the lack of cylinder head flow (even with ported heads). The cost increase for a 4.2L over a 3.8L is minimal.

You are going to need a fuel and engine management hardware/software capable of supporting the power level. To run 11's you can rely on an in tank pump and 80lb injectors, matching MAF, and associated intake hardware. You'll need to tune it and being you are in CT, you might want to hit up some of the local members when the time comes. There are some really fast SC's with properly qualified owners who can help you with that when you are ready for that. The stock EEC will handle the job without difficulty, but you will have to run a piggy back tuner known around here as the "Quarterhorse". It is fully programmable and provides real time data acquisition and live updating.

You have some choices for induction. As mentioned above, a fully kitted out M90 can get you there if you want to go that route. My biggest issue with this route is that the blower is small and requires tons of overdrive to get the job done. Reliability and consistency become an issue due to the fact that the blower is simply being asked to do something it was never designed to do.

An aftermarket blower that sits on top of the motor (Whipple, TVS, KB, etc.) can definitely get the job done too but there is no commercially available kit to do so. It's going to be custom with lots of complex fabrication.

Turbo is a great option too if you want to do it yourself and have some abilities (you'll have to make your own hot and cold sides), particularly if you are going to use the automatic and even more so if you trade the AOD in for a C4 with trans brake. In this case 11's would be a low side goal and 10's would be within reach.

I've built many high HP engines for people on this board, I am an independent engine builder who specializes in the 3.8/4.2L V6 so if you have any need or interest you can hit me up off the board at the email in my sig. I'm not using this as a selling platform but we will cross paths sooner or later so you may as well know what I do and where I'm coming from with what I say. You can also see some of my shop and projects by clicking the SCUI link in one of the banner ads at the top of this page.

I emailed you before I even read this from my work email lol
 
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