Quit running? Maybe crnk sensr? What are the signs

Edman1000

Registered User
I was driving through a parking lot yesterday and it just quit running. It started back up and I drove about 100' and it quit again. IT acted like it was out of gas, so I put some in it and nothing. I towed it home and played with it some more, I turned it over and it'd almost catch then nothing. I squirted some gas into the intake and it fired for about 3 secs but rreally rough. So I figured it was the Feul pump, changed that....Nothing! SO i tried to squrit some gas intop it again it it didn't even fire this time.

NEED HELP...should i go rent a code scanner?

Should I suspect the crank sensor?

Should I suspect the cam sensor?

Should I burn it?
 
Could be the Crank sensor, mine was a little flacky when it was on the way out. It would crank and run for about 10 minutes then die. Wouldn't crank until it sat for a while, then die soon after. Get a code reader from WalMart (or what ever discount store with an autoparts dept is near you) for about $30.00 If the fault code is from the crank sensor, you should get "211" or "PIP".
 
Ok.....

Alright man! Rented the code scanner it said there was a fuel circuit error. Changed the pump, checked the relay, I'm thinking pcm or the DIS.

When you push the little schrader valve on the fuel rail, should the gas suirt out or just kind of dribble? I pushed it in the other day and it just kind of dribbled out. I figured if should be under pressure and squirt right out.

What should I check next?
 
I would have checked the FUEL FILTER FIRST and replaced it, around 5USD, before you bought a new fuel pump and relays. Seems like trash in the line or fuel filter.

Calvin
 
true but....

True but wouldn't it run if I squirted gas into the intake? Also I've never heard of a car just dying out of the blue. Wouldn't it run like crap first? I'm thinking electrical?
 
Re: true but....

Edman1000 said:
True but wouldn't it run if I squirted gas into the intake?
It will run if you shooting fuel in there, but once it uses it up......POOF, no more run! FUEL FILTER, would be my best guess. Then get back with us.......Try the EASY things first! Common sense!!!

Like I said FUEL FILTER. Just try it!

Calvin
 
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True but wouldn't it run if I squirted gas into the intake?

Exactly where did you squirt the gas into the intake ? For one thing, there really isn't any way to do it and expect the car to run.

For example, if you squirted it into the MAF, it might start a fire or the fuel would never make it to the intake manifold considering it would have to travel uphill to the throttle body then down the plenum to the back of the supercharger and maybe some fumes get sucked into the bypass valve and reach the manifold, but most of the fuel would have to go through the supercharger then out the upper IC tube, through the intercooler, then up the lower IC tube to the intake manifold adaptor and down into the very back of the intake manifold. If any fuel managed to make it this far it was most likely consumed by the #3 cylinder since it is the closest to the intake inlet.

I don't think you squirted fuel into the MAF but I'm guessing you put it in the throttle body. This is not a carburated engine...squirting fuel into the intake isn't going to do anything good.

David
 
Re: Ok.....

Edman1000 said:
Alright man! Rented the code scanner it said there was a fuel circuit error. Changed the pump, checked the relay, I'm thinking pcm or the DIS.

When you push the little schrader valve on the fuel rail, should the gas suirt out or just kind of dribble? I pushed it in the other day and it just kind of dribbled out. I figured if should be under pressure and squirt right out.

What should I check next?

Calm down... Work the problem, don't just swap parts.

What was the code # you received. If you have an automatic and the up shift light is lit while cranking, that means you have a failed crank sensor signal.

Crank and no start, check for spark first. If spark, check for fuel pressure using a external fuel pressure gauge. Without knowing how that is working, you can't assume anything else.
 
Changed the fuel filter .....Nuttin!

Dave - I squirted the gas into the throttle body...Hope I didn't screw anything up??

Mike - the code I got from the scanner was for a fuel circuit problem. I jumped the pumped relay and still nothing. I checked to see if the relay is getting juice, it is.

I have seen the upshift light come on when I'm cranking it but not all the time. I did not recieve any codes for a crank sensor.
 
Can I test it?

Anybody know how to test the crank sensor? Can I check it with an ohmeter or something? How about the PCM, I know I can take it to the parts store and have them check it but where is it located on our cars?
 
Here we go again...

Really quick, and take my advice here, reach down into the harmonic balancer pulley and make sure the bolt for the harmonic balancer is still there!! I would not recommend that you try starting it any more till you verify that the harmonic balancer bolt is still in position and not broken off.

Let us know what you find.

Phil
 
The crank sensor is just an hall effect device. It should have 3 senses for each crank shaft revolution as the sensing ring has 3 slots.

On the automatics the easiest trouble shooting is crank the engine and watch the upshift light. If it flashes, the crank sensor is bad. Without the crank (PIP) signal, the DIS nor the EEC can even hope to guess when they should fire or trigger the injectors so the system simply doesn't even try. It also will not return a trouble code if you get no start due to the Crank sensor.

And I would agree, check your crank bolt and harmonic balancer to make sure it's attached still.
 
No up shift light when crankin

No up shift light when crankin, but it comes on when I turn the key to run.

Now, i'm scared....I didn't check the Harmonic Balancer bolt But I will as soon as I get home.
 
Re: No up shift light when crankin

Edman1000 said:
No up shift light when crankin, but it comes on when I turn the key to run.
That's OK. Its supposed to do that. If the arrow turns off, then the PIP signal is making it to the EEC, and the crank sensor is not the problem.
Do you have fuel pressure at the rails?
 
TbirdSCFan quote:

Do you have fuel pressure at the rails?

Well like I said:


When you push the little schrader valve on the fuel rail, should the gas suirt out or just kind of dribble? I pushed it in the other day and it just kind of dribbled out. I figured if should be under pressure and squirt right out?

Right after I turned the key on and off. I don't think I'm hearing the fuel pump.
I'm gonna take it in and have it diagnosed. There are going to charge me an arm and leg but WTF! I need my wheels.
 
In the unlikely event the fuel pump is not coming on cause of something screwed up on the crash sensor in the back, you can just bypass this...I had to on one SC...ran a switch to the dash for the fuel pump that's connected into the fuse box. Takes 3 feet of wire and old household on/off light switch.
 
You never..

You never mentioned whether or not you checked the harmonic balancer bolt to see if it was still in place.. To check the fuel pump, simply have someone put there ear to the bottom passenger side near the fuel tank while you turn the key on. There should be a roughly 2 second pulse of the fuel pump as it primes the fuel rail with fuel. Did you change the filter? If the pump actuall gets that 2 second pulse, does it sound like it may be straining? May be a clogged fuel inlet strainer on the pump itself. Check these things.. And please check the HB bolt to see if it is still there.

Phil
 
Originally posted by Edman1000

When you push the little schrader valve on the fuel rail, should the gas suirt out or just kind of dribble? I pushed it in the other day and it just kind of dribbled out. I figured if should be under pressure and squirt right out?

Right after I turned the key on and off. I don't think I'm hearing the fuel pump.
I think you're on the right track. It should do more than dribble out. You can put your ear on the fuel tank filler tube and listen for the pump when you have someone turn the key on to be sure. I'm assuming that you have a wiring diagram and know how to jumper past the relay.
Lastly, it could be the fuel pump itself. You can wire 12Volts directly to it from the relay to see if it runs. Oh, and there is a fuse also that you should check... Fuse, inertia switch, relay, and diode across the fuel pump motor.. I don't know where the diode is, but if it goes, it would blow fuses and cause the motor not to run. ;)
 
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