Piston and rod selection for 400hp attempt

I need some advise on which pistons and rods to buy for my new engine project. I will be taking the block to the machine shop to have the piston walls cleaned up. I hear that it is good not to go any more than you have to on the walls. I hope to achieve 400hp, and I have considered going to Coy Miller for pistons and rods. I just need to weigh my alternatives. Also any advise on rod and main bearings would help. I will be having a machine shop to clean up everything, but this will be my first attemp at a full on rebuild. I appreciate any advise in advance.

Dirtybird91

I've got a set of CAT H-beam rods. They are 351W rods but made in the 6.2" length for custom applications. Then I had Diamond piston make me a set of pistons to work with them. When they were done, my piston/rod combo was 120 grams lighter each than the stock setup and good for 100 hp per cylinder. I like the setup but it's pricey.

Slysc said:

I've got a set of CAT H-beam rods. They are 351W rods but made in the 6.2" length for custom applications. Then I had Diamond piston make me a set of pistons to work with them. When they were done, my piston/rod combo was 120 grams lighter each than the stock setup and good for 100 hp per cylinder. I like the setup but it's pricey.

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That sound awesome man. That's just the type of thing that I want to do, but I don't know who to contact to get started.

Dirtybirdie

I wouldn't bother to send anything to the machine shop until you have the pistons in hand. You don't want them to start any cylinder work (and a good shop shouldn't start any cylinder work) until you have the pistons on hand so everything can be measured for the specific bores they will go into.

BTM had a group purchase going on with pistons and rods. you might want to see if you can still get in on it:

http://www.bluetonguemotorsports.com/BTMParts/3_8PistonRodGP.html

Mike8675309 said:

I wouldn't bother to send anything to the machine shop until you have the pistons in hand. You don't want them to start any cylinder work (and a good shop shouldn't start any cylinder work) until you have the pistons on hand so everything can be measured for the specific bores they will go into.

BTM had a group purchase going on with pistons and rods. you might want to see if you can still get in on it:

http://www.bluetonguemotorsports.com/BTMParts/3_8PistonRodGP.html

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Thank very much for that advise Mike. I will definately take you up on that!

Dirtybird

I have H beam 351 rods as well as teh diamond pistin setup..Also got teh goldcoat from swaintech..They will definately handle00hp

I have H beam 351 rods as well as teh diamond pistin setup..Also got teh goldcoat from swaintech..They will definately handle 400hp

I have H beam 351 rods as well as the diamond pistin setup..Also got teh goldcoat from swaintech..They will definately handle 400hp..And yes Paul at BTM can hook you up

LOL Damon! You got your point arcross three times!

I will be looking to get my hands on some of the rods and pistons that Mike suggested, but I may miss the group purchase thing. I just invested in an EXTREME AOD tranny from Art Carr with a "10 torque converter so I will have to save more cash.
I am really pumped up about this project!
Dirtybirdie

Make sure you discuss the Swain-tech coatings with whoever you are ordering from. I'm not sure at what HP range they make the most sense. Could be they are recommended at all levels considering our supercharged application.

Thermal coatings sure dont hurt anything!

Mike8675309 said:

Make sure you discuss the Swain-tech coatings with whoever you are ordering from. I'm not sure at what HP range they make the most sense. Could be they are recommended at all levels considering our supercharged application.

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Thanks again Mike! You have been more of a help to me than you realize. I want to do this engine the right way from oil pan up!

Dirtybird91

H Beam Rods

I have CAT H Beam Super Race Rods as well as custom made Diamond Pistons. If you are looking for a set of rods, I can get you a set of CAT H Beams for around $250. Drop me an email if interested. The top SC's have CAT H Beam Rods in their blocks. They'll withstand whatever you throw at them.

supercatxr7@yahoo.com

Mark

How the hell did that happen..haha Typos and all!!!


Geesh..And swaintech goldcoat will help immensley with our application..Also you can get the combustion chambers of yoru heads coated....I did:O)//No hotspots means less chance of detonation..More boost sounds like a good idea :O)_

Thermal coatings are very benifical on boosted engines.

Frank,

I've got the same CAT rods Mark mentioned with custom Ross pistons. After seeing several people struggle with building their own engine, I would urge you work with someone who has some experince with these built up SC engines. It's not quite the same as rebuilding a stock one.

Most people run into problems with the rod/crank bearings and valvetrain geometry.

David

bearings

One thing I noticed is that the chamfer on the inside vs. the outside of the 351 rods are different than the SC rods. This is due to the fact that the 351 crank has the rods positioned next to eachother and the SC crank has a piece of crank between the rods. The SC crank requires the same chamfer on each side of the rods. But then again, I guess I just used the 351 rod bearings and didn't do anything to match the chamfer and my car has been running that way so it must not be too big of an issue.

Why not be a real trailblazer and try using aluminum rods?
Folks say it shouldn't be done on the street but nobody's really tried it so who knows.

Another setup to try if you want to be creative is to get the Chevy rods and offset grind your crank to the smaller Chevy rod
journal. This will effectively stroke your crank and yield a few more cubes. I was thinking about doing this but I chickened out when I saw how little crank would be left between the rods. But this is what Chris Wise did and he hasn't broke his crank (yet).

If you call Diamond pistons, they should know what the specs. are that you need for whatever rod you use and whatever compression ratio you want. They've done enough custom SC pistons that they should be able to get them right without being spoonfed every dimension.

my pistons

The SC crank requires the same chamfer on each side of the rods. But then again, I guess I just used the SC rod bearings and didn't do anything to match the chamfer and my car has been running that way so it must not be too big of an issue

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If your crank is ground and the machinist radiused (sp?) the rod journals, you won't be able to use the SC rod bearing (or at least I couldn't). Also, on mine, the orientation of the Windsor rod did matter because of the offset bearing location. I had to go with custom machined rod bearings.

I've run aluminum rods in street engines before and its not a good idea on a daily driver, if you go with aluminum rods I hope the car is a Saterday night special only type thing.
Aluminum rods are not meant for daily use and do not live long.
Use at your own risk!