Bleeding help!

iwannanSC

Registered User
I have just replaced all 4 of my calipers, and had the lines off and just hanging there for about 2 weeks. All the fluid drained out of the reservior during this time. Now I have put the new brakes on and I am in the process of bleeding the brakes, but I am getting a ton of air and have run through alot of fluid. Do I need to take off and bleed the mastercylinder? Or will it eventually work if I just keep bleeding each caliper one by one.

Thanks for the help,

Matt
 
i would open all the bleeders and keep the master cylinder full and let it bleed through as much as possible then
bleed like manual says bleed rear with key off and pummp pedal 20 times then bleed front with key on
 
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It's important that you follow brake bleeding procedures exactly, otherwise you'll be left with a system that's unreliable at best.

Here's the directions for bleeding brakes on an ABS vehicle:

BRAKE SYSTEM BLEEDING

The anti-lock brake system must be bled in two steps:

Tools Required:

l Anti-Lock Test Adapter T90P-50-ALA

1. The master cylinder and hydraulic control unit must be bled using Anti-Lock Test Adapter T90P-50-ALA or equivalent. If this procedure is not followed, air will be trapped in the Hydraulic Control Unit which will eventually lead to a spongy brake pedal.


To bleed the master cylinder and HCU, disconnect the 55-pin plug from the ABS module and install the Anti-Lock Test Adapter to the wire harness 55-pin plug.

a. Place bleed/harness switch in bleed position.

b. Turn ignition to ON position. At this point the red OFF indicator should turn on.

c. Push motor button on adapter down. This starts the pump motor. The red OFF indicator will turn off and the green ON indicator will turn on. The pump motor will run for 60 seconds once the motor button is pushed. If the pump motor is to be turned off for any reason before this 60 seconds has elapsed, push the abort button and the pump motor will turn off.

d. After 20 seconds of pump motor operation, push and hold the valve button down. Hold valve button for 20 seconds then release.

e. The pump will continue to run for an additional 20 seconds.

2. The brake lines can be bled in the conventional manner. Refer to «Section 06-06».

Bleed in the following sequence:

l RH Rear

l LH Front

l LH Rear

l RH Front

If you don't have ABS, then you can do this one of two ways-either get someone to help you, or use one of the one-person pump systems available at a parts store.

If you do it with one person in the car, and you bleeding, here's the way to get the air out:

Fill the MC up to the top line and replace the cover. Starting with the right rear, have the person in the car pump the brake 3-5 strokes, then hold-open the bleeder screw-you will hear and see air and some fluid-and quickly close it. Repeat the pump sequence and open and close the bleed screw again & again until you have straight fluid-make sure that you check the MC level often.

Follow this procedure at each corner of the vehicle, moving from RR to LR to RF to LF-once you get straight fluid at the RR bleed, you'll find it easier at the other three-and you'll have clean fluid in all lines when you are done.

FYI-opening all 4 corners and allowing the MC to bleed through will throw the proportioning valve off, creating an unequal braking force to front or rear and negating the ABS.
 
Ok, so it's time to replace the mastercylinder. Where can I get a remanufactured unit? I know Prior Reman has them but they're pretty expensive. Any ideas?

Thanks,
Matt
 
iwannanSC said:
Ok, so it's time to replace the mastercylinder. Where can I get a remanufactured unit? I know Prior Reman has them but they're pretty expensive. Any ideas?

Thanks,
Matt
?? :confused: ?? Not sure replacing the master cylinder will solve your how-to-bleed issue.
But if it helps, you should know that to bleed the rear brakes, you turn the key on rather than off, open the bleed valve, and push the brake pedal. close valve, release pedal, repeat until fluid flows out. Don't wait more than a 4-5 seconds btwn pushes of the pedal. This may take a while if air got into the lines, but your other choice is to buy a kit which lets you pre bleed just the main valve.

Bleed order: RR, LR, RF, LF. On the front brakes, you turn the key off. Then after you've done them all, do them again if you have a spongy pedal. This is from air bubbling back up when you are switching over to the other wheel.
It also helps to have clear tubing running from the bleeder valve to a partial container of brake fluid to keep air from coming back into the caliper. You should be able to get this from any pet supply store. Make sure it fits tight.

If you decide otherwise that you need a new HCU, I saw one on ebay last week, and priorreman probably has the best prices on rebuilt units, even if it seems rather high.
 
Oh, and until you get a steady stream of fluid out of the bleed valves, don't be afraid to recycle the fluid through the system multiple times. Once you have it solid though, you want clean/clear fluid.
 
That service description comes straight from the Ford manual-any other method leaves you at risk of brake failure.
 
proportioning valve replacement

How do you bleed them when you replace the proportioning valve? We bled by the manual and notice 2 stages on the peddle and ABS light. Your advice would be great.
 
OK.. point duely noted..

That is fine if you are a factory service department with a lot of special purpose (high $) tools. However, if you are willing to research the topic and then rely on your own judgement and accept that the job can be done in your driveway by yourself, and exercise some caution, the job is doable with no special tools...

Just as an example... when my brakes were failing a few years ago, I called up the Ford dealership and asked them what it meant.. their reply (not surprisingly) was (said with a slow talking texas accent) "well, you know ABS is a comlicated system.. you could get hurt severly if you don't know what you're doin.. but we'd have to run a diagnostic on it first and that runs about $100, which applies to the bill if we do the work (Hook set!) and let me look it up here.... Oh yeah... says here a new brake unit runs $1400" :eek: :eek: :eek:

OK, so at that point, for $1500 worth of questionable information, and exercising the option to seek alternatives, I decide to research the topic here at SCCOA. Turns out, my accumulator was worn out.. Ordered a new one for around $250, read up on how to install it, and fixed it myself. Now here's the hitch.. later, read up on the diagnostic procedure from a shop manual... nowhere in that manual did it state the 2 most common failures of the Teves II ABS: worn accumulator, and failed pump motor relay.

Anyways, I guess my point is this is the place to get some of the most cost effective repair advice you'll ever get, keeping in mind that no amount of advice is a substitute for thinking and you yourself are responsible for the results.
 
TbirdSCfan,

Thanks for the info. I've done brake work on this car before, and I know the procedures for bleeding the brakes. It's just that this time, I can't get much of a pedal. And the weird thing is that the 'brake' and 'abs' lights don't come one when I'm braking, and don't stay on when the car is running. They don't act abnormally! I've talked to a mechanic I trust and he thinks my mastercylinder has gone up. I JUST bought an accumulator from Prior a few months ago, so I really don't need another one. Maybe they will take a few bucks off and not send one.

Matt
 
Is the mastercylinder (not the whole ABS assembly with booster, etc., but JUST the M/C) the same as the M/C on a '93 SC?
 
Sorry for the late reply. I don't think a 93 master cylinder will work for you. The Teves II is a complete unit which is expensive to replace. Someone can correct me, but I believe the 93 uses the Teves IV which is a totally different design which relys on a conventional vaccuum power assist, and has the ABS control separate.

I would suggest you try to bleed the brakes again and again, or take it to a shop and explain that you need the master cylinder bled. They'll know what to do. The reason I suggest this is, assuming that your brakes worked before you replaced the calipers, there is absolutely no reason why the main valve of the HCU should coincidently go bad. Its just hard to get the air out of the main valve. They make a special tool for that purpose where you remove the brake lines at the HCU, and attach short flexible lines that feed the fluid back up into the reservoir, then you just pump pump pump pump until they're clear and then reattach the main lines and bleed as usual.

BTW, I'm sure you've figured out not to do that again. ;)
 
ABS Bleeding Help!

Ok i just bought a Anti-Lock Test Adapter T90P-50-ALA to bleed the antilock system and the hcu. Where exactly is the 55 pin wiring harness i am supposed to connect to? Any takers? please??
 
We've replaced quite a few of the Teves II units and we just bleed them like the manual says....

No problems, but it takes quite a bit fo fluid to flush out the lines.....
 
I think that the 55-pin harness is in the trunk at the ABS module. I could be wrong, however. On the 93+ cars, the harness is in the driver's fenderwell. But I had my 90's fender off not too long ago, and it wasn't in there.

If you haven't taken the rack in the trunk down yet, it can be a little difficult, but it is simple in theory. You have to take a long pair of needle-nose pliers, reach up and grab the notches in the black plastic pin on the left side of the rack. Turn it about 90 degrees or until the notches line up with the slots in the metal of the car body. Then you can pull the pin out, or just pull the rack down with the pin. There are a couple little metal clips that help to support the sides as well, but they just squeeze out. The rack actually doesn't come completely down - the left side swivels down and the right side stays attached.

So, how much did the brake tool cost? It might be a good idea to buy one for the club so that it could be lent out as needed. (There can't be too many of these floating around, can there?)
 
'89 SC - brake issues

Help!!! I really miss driving my car and no-one can seem to figure out what is wrong. The car has a small leak in the hydraulic control center, but I always make sure my brake fluid is topped up with no braking problems. The last time I drove it the brake pedal went rock hard, no stopping :mad: What makes the pedal to go rock hard? Fluid is full, red and yellow brake lights stay on at all times now. My husband thinks it could be the ABS motor. Is there anyway to figure this out? I am tired of sitting in my car wishing I could stop it! Summer is hear and I wanna drive my car!

Thanks,

Christine
 
Yes, it could be the ABS motor (expensive). Or maybe the ABS relay on the passenger side of the firewall in the engine bay (cheap). Or, if your ignition switch (the electrical component, inside the steering column) is bad, it could possibly create an intermittent condition like that. But if the problem is constant, it is probably related to the ABS unit itself. The brake fluid leak is also a definite clue that you may have a problem with the ABS unit.

When you turn the key to "on" (but before you start the car), do you hear a humming from the motor? If so, does it stop eventually? What about when you press the pedal? Is there any humming afterward? That could be a sign of a bad hydraulic Accumulator.

Also, I wonder if the pressure switch on the master cylinder is going bad. If the relay checks out ok, but the motor still won't run, the pressure switch may be broken. If the switch is ok, then it is probably a bad pump motor.

Oh, and the most simple of all - do check the fuse as well.

There is a good diagnostic guide that has been posted around here several times. I can't find it at the moment, though.
 
I didn't read all the forums but I had a really bad time too.

My problem was that the front calipers were on the wrong sides which would put the bleeder on the bottom...they should be at the top. I felt like a real ~~~ when I finally bought it to a shop, but I didn't take the old ones off...had no idea.
 
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