Need Tips, (Clutch Related)

[SuperCoupe007]

Hey guys/gals, i have a 90 5-Speed. I was having trouble going into 1st from a stop, or any gear for that matter. mmm Well to make a long story short some members recommended me to add a shim, and that that might resolve the issue. I installed a Center Force Dual Friction Plate about 25K miles ago (i know, not the best choice) Well the tranny is down and i am not sure what i should check or do to make sure that this time, i don't have any tranny problems.. any help and tips would be greatly appreciated... thanks in advance guys.. :)

[SuperCoupe007]

anybody ??? :confused: :confused: :confused:

[Douglas Walker]

I had the same problem. Before the motor pull I learned to hold the clutch in while stopped because if I let it out Id have to shut the car off at time to get it in gear. I hated it. Now with the motor out Im replacing everything clutch related. I have even bought a new flywheel. I have read about the shimming and If all the new parts dont take care of it ill try it. Other than I dont know what else to tell you.
Later
Doug

[Tony8470]

I'm pretty sure you only have to use a shim if you have had the flywheel turned. Did you try bleeding the hydraulic line really good too?

[SuperCoupe007]

Thanks for the replise "Douglas Walker" & "Tony8470". So far i've taken the Flywheel, Clutch Plate, and Pressure Plate to two clutch specialty shops and they have both told me that all of the equipment looks fine and when they tested the pressure plate that it was working properly. When i installed the center force clutch, i had the flywheel turned, and it only has around 25K easy going miles.. I also replaced the slave cylinder and everything else associated with the clutch. I have bled the hydraulic lines in two or three different occassions with no good result.. I asked to see if they offered a shim for the flywheel, but their catalog didn't show one made for the SC... So i guess i am gonna have to go to Home Depot and get a small shim and install it where the slave cylinder sits (if thats where people would recommend me to put it) How thick should the shim be ?? and any specific type of material ???

P.S. How thick is the Flywheel supposed to be ?? and whats the most it could be cut before being useless ???

Thanks guys..

[mfewtrail]

Did you check to see if the entire clutch linkage was properly adjusted?(check for proper free-play and all..)

EDIT: or do the SC's have an automatic adjustment to compensate for excessive play in the linkage?

[FearThis SC]

I'm pretty sure you only have to use a shim if you have had the flywheel turned.
I would disagree that you have to shim every flywheel after getting it turned. I replaced my clutch and had the flywheel re-surfaced and had no need for shims. But I was dealing with the original clutch and flywheel. I believe this was the first clutch job on it......having said that, if you are replacing the clutch for the second or third time, then I would see a need for shims.

[Tony8470]

There are definitely shims available for our cars. I put one on with my own 2 hands. Find a place that knows their stuff, and they will have one for you no problem. 23.75mm or .94". is the minumum thickness allowed for the flywheel. The stock thickness is .990" Find how thick yours is, and add a shim to make it as close to stock as possible would be my only thinking.

[scbird1]

I made my own shim from from sheet metal. The fly wheel had been cut down 2x and now the travel is just right. If your clutch starts to grab mid peddle then there is no need to shim it. You might need new syncros or maybe some of that syncromesh trans fluid. Dose wonders for shifting probs.

[SuperCoupe007]

mfewtrail: I thought our cars didn't have an adjustment due to being hydraulic ?? :confused: I hope there is one, would make it much easier to fix..

FearThis SC: I have only turned the flywheel once, but i am not sure how much they took off from it.

Tony8470: Thanks for the specs, I am gonna go check them right now. Now i should know where it stans what i might need done to it :)

scbird1: If i remember correctly, my clutch does start to engage at mid travel of the pedal. But i get the strong feeling that my clutch is not completely dis-engaging because sometimes when i am sitting at a stop sign with it in 1st gear and i release the brake pedal, the car starts to creep ; and thats with the clutch fully pressed.. :( How can i check to see if i need new synchros ????
What is syncromesh fluid and what advantages/disadvantages does it have ????

Thanks....

[mfewtrail]

mfewtrail: I thought our cars didn't have an adjustment due to being hydraulic ?? :confused: I hope there is one, would make it much easier to fix..

FearThis SC: I have only turned the flywheel once, but i am not sure how much they took off from it.

Tony8470: Thanks for the specs, I am gonna go check them right now. Now i should know where it stans what i might need done to it :)

scbird1: If i remember correctly, my clutch does start to engage at mid travel of the pedal. But i get the strong feeling that my clutch is not completely dis-engaging because sometimes when i am sitting at a stop sign with it in 1st gear and i release the brake pedal, the car starts to creep ; and thats with the clutch fully pressed.. :( How can i check to see if i need new synchros ????
What is syncromesh fluid and what advantages/disadvantages does it have ????

Thanks....

I didn't know if they had an adjustment either, I was sorta asking, I haven't ever worked on any 5spd SC's. Even some hydraulic linkages have adjustments that can be made(just follow the connection to the clutch pedal and see if the linkage is properly routed and nothing has came loose)but I'm unsure if the SC's are this way.

EDIT: Try this if you think the clutch isn't releasing fully, 1. Start the engine and depress the clutch pedal. 2. Shift the transmisssion into first gear but do not release the clutch, then shift the transmission into neutral. 3. Wait 5-10 seconds, then attempt to shift the transmission into reverse, if the shift causes gear clash/grinding, check the clutch linkage(this is out of a book I have on manual transmissions/transaxles). IF there are no problems with the linkage, the clutch must be disassembled and inspected. Clutch drag can be caused by a warped disc or pressure plate, a loose disc facing, incorrect clutch pedal adjustment, or a defective release lever.

[SuperCoupe007]

mfewtrail: I wish i could try your recommendations, but unfortinately the tranny is already down :D I just got fed up with havig to shift into 3rd than 4th just to get into 1st gear... When i had the clutch and pressure plate tested they told me that the clutch still had about 60% life left and that the pressure plate was working properly and within specifications...

P.S. I just went to Pep Boys to have the flywheel measured and it showed 0.979" / 24.87mm thichkness. According to the specificatoins that Tony8470 gave me, its within boundaries.

Soooo if i take (stock thickness) - (measured thickness of my flywheel) = the thickness of the shim that i should place where the slave cylender sits... Am i in the right path ???
0.99" - 0.979" = 0.011" :confused:
So i can go to Home Depot and purchase a small shim or 0.011" thick ???


Hhhmmmm can that small amount that has been shaved off the flywheel have such a huge affect on my clutch ??? or am i approaching my problem the wrong way ???? :confused:

[SuperCoupe007]

would a shim made of aluminum be good enough ??? :confused:

[scbird1]

The thickness of the shim should be close to what is removed. Very thinn but that will work also

[SuperCoupe007]

The guys at Home Depot are gonna think I am crazy when i ask them for a shim that is 0.011" thick made of aluminum... :D
but its all good, as long as it works like a charm....

[SuperCoupe007]

Damn, according to my calculations, the shim would have to be 0.2794mm thick, is that even possible ????? :confused: