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porsche911
07-20-2004, 04:32 AM
aloha,

just to get you up to speed, i posted a couple days ago about my 93sc fan problems. thanks cato and xr7 dave for your replies, but i am still baffled a bit.

i have tested the fan, it works both hi and lo speeds when 12v is applied. i believe its the low speed that works when the ac is on, and it is functioning properly.

currently the only way i can drive the car is to keep the ac on. i went to checker/krager auto parts and they special ordered me a fan control relay, it was 29 bucks, and a shot in the dark. i get that part on friday. hell i dont even know where that part goes. does any one here?

i have not done the KOER test yet. i do not have a scanner to read the codes. i have read of fusible links be suspect in this case and also the IRC module (still not sure what IRC stands for) but i have located it behind the pass headlight.

where do i poke my fingers next? im guessing that the way the engine cools itself is to monitor the readings from the temp sensor located near the intake, and then by way of the irc it tells the fan to go fast or go faster.....how am i doing do far?

with the ac on and the fan working, what probable parts can be ruled out? would this rule the fusible link out because the fan is actually working?

could I have a bad temp sensor?

many thanks in advance.

still spinning wheels in hawaii,

kyle
krm944@hotmail.com

XR7 Dave
07-20-2004, 07:50 AM
If the fan comes on with the A/C then the IRCM is working and the computer has control of the fan. That leaves only the coolant sensor either being bad or not recieving a signal. If you unplug the sensor the fan should come on imediately. However you can't drive like that as the computer will not know what temperature the engine is at.

If it works when you pull the sensor plug then it is either a bad sensor or you may have an air pocket in the motor.

Speaking of which, how hot does the motor get? And is the radiator full? Not the overflow tank, the radiator itself, is it full?

porsche911
07-20-2004, 08:14 AM
If the fan comes on with the A/C then the IRCM is working and the computer has control of the fan. That leaves only the coolant sensor either being bad or not recieving a signal. If you unplug the sensor the fan should come on imediately. However you can't drive like that as the computer will not know what temperature the engine is at.

If it works when you pull the sensor plug then it is either a bad sensor or you may have an air pocket in the motor.

Speaking of which, how hot does the motor get? And is the radiator full? Not the overflow tank, the radiator itself, is it full?


the radiator is full. it was replaced a few days ago and it has been run about 75 miles since then. if there is a bubble in the system wont it work its way to the top?

if i drive the car without the ac on it gets hot. the temp gauge will get past the m if you let it. i wont let it get that far. i shut it down as it rests on the m.

to test your theory, i should start the car without ac on. pull the temp sensor and the fan should come on? will it be the hi speed or low speed? i can check it right now. its parked out back!!!

kyle

XR7 Dave
07-20-2004, 08:35 AM
Why did you replace the radiator? Did it burst/crack or did it just start leaking? Have you always kept a good mixture of antifreeze in the car? When did the fan stop working? If the two are connected then I would be concerned about an air pocket. Air pockets will often work themselves out but not always. Does your heater work properly?

porsche911
07-20-2004, 08:44 AM
i have had problems with this car for years. last july it had a new motor installed. after the install i still could not drive it as the mech said the radiator was partially clogged restricting flow and giving a poor cooling. i left for the war and came back determined to dump the car, with new motor and new trans.....i couldnt even get $1300 for it so i decided that my wife was gong to drive it. i installed the new radiator on friday hoping my overheating was over. not the case. we sat in traffic for about 20 minutes with the ac on and it cooled well. we decided the ac wasnt cold so we turned it off and the temp began its climb.

i searched here and posted my first attempt at help. after a few hours of reading i realized that the ac being on and cool running went hand in hand. today in about 80 degree temps we drove teh car about 40 miles and an hour straight. the temp will climb to the r when travelling up a mountain. it cools itself off as you coast down the other side of the mountain. we are driving with the ac switch to on.

and tonight i tested the fan with 12v applied and found hi and low work

kyle

XR7 Dave
07-20-2004, 10:07 AM
i searched here and posted my first attempt at help. after a few hours of reading i realized that the ac being on and cool running went hand in hand. today in about 80 degree temps we drove teh car about 40 miles and an hour straight. the temp will climb to the r when travelling up a mountain. it cools itself off as you coast down the other side of the mountain. we are driving with the ac switch to on. Just so you know, when the fan is turned on via the AC it will automatically switch OFF when you reach approximately 45mph. The computer decides that there should be enough air flowing through the radiator at that speed that a fan would not be needed.

porsche911
07-20-2004, 07:33 PM
dave,

i just took the car on another journey over the mountain here in hawaii. today its about 78 or 80 out and again maintaining about 65 or 70 over teh mountain, it will only climb to about the r maybe the m in norm. as i break the peak and coast down the other side it drops back to n or o range. but this is only with the ac on. if i turn the ac off i have overheating problems and i dont want to ruin a new engine with about 1 thousand miles on it. i dont test it to see if my fans will kick on past the m range.

i have decided that because i am deploying and my wife will be here alone with the car that i am going to have it looked at by the mechanics on base. mayeb they can read the codes and see if the IRCM or eec or anything else may be faulty.

i really appreciate your help thus far and i will update you and this board as i fix it. it seems that this is a very very common thing with our thunderchickens and everyone is prone to this.

kyle
krm944@hotmail.com

porsche911
07-21-2004, 11:41 PM
update i just took my thunderchicken to a wrench to have the overheating problem looked at. i must be crazy, as the tech tells me its fine. he tells me on the phone "with the car sitting in the shop the gauge went to 3/4 the fan kicked on and cooled it down to about 1/2 on the gauge" so i think your overheating problem is fixed, and your supercharger bearing is bad..you need a new supercharger. and to fix the ac, you need a new compressor and ........................(no longer listening to him)...........so that'll set you back $1100 just for ac.


where can i source a used but reliable supercharger? how much should i expect to pay?

kyle

Darkside
07-21-2004, 11:51 PM
Look in the Parts for Sale Forum. Theres somebody selling two of them for 125 each. I think his name is titaniumsc03 or something like that.

porsche911
07-22-2004, 12:32 AM
Look in the Parts for Sale Forum. Theres somebody selling two of them for 125 each. I think his name is titaniumsc03 or something like that.


i just placed a wanted ad in the classifieds here. i have a couple other questions pertaining to the SC.

how hard is it to replace? is it a simple few bolts a couple hoses and drive away in half an hour?i will be away and my buddy will be installing it for me hes a good wrench, but not the sharpest tool in the shed.

will my car run without the sc for a month or two until i can replace it myself?

would you (the person reading this, yes you) buy a used sc from someone here on the board and pay to ahve it shipped to hawaii? what if i get it and it doesnt work? or lasts only a month? how about an ac compressor? am i better off with rebuilt parts?

Darkside
07-22-2004, 01:51 AM
i just placed a wanted ad in the classifieds here. i have a couple other questions pertaining to the SC.

how hard is it to replace? is it a simple few bolts a couple hoses and drive away in half an hour?i will be away and my buddy will be installing it for me hes a good wrench, but not the sharpest tool in the shed.

will my car run without the sc for a month or two until i can replace it myself?

would you (the person reading this, yes you) buy a used sc from someone here on the board and pay to ahve it shipped to hawaii? what if i get it and it doesnt work? or lasts only a month? how about an ac compressor? am i better off with rebuilt parts?

The supercharger is attached to the intake manifold with 3 bolts. That's it. Take out those 3 bolts and unbolt the intake plenum off the backside of the SC and it will come right off. Easy. 1/2 to 1 hour job. You can drive your car without the supercharger as well. Just take off the SC belt and zip tie the bypass open and your car will drive like a N/A Thunderbird. You can also run low octane gas while your car is like this. So if you just want to drive it till you get back just take off the SC belt. BTW, the bypass is located at the rear of the sc on the intake plenum. It is a lever that is controlled by vacuum. Sorry if this is confusing, it's late over here (1:30 A.M.) and I'm tired.

As far as the compressor goes, I would buy a used one from a junkyard over there. Just buy it from a reputable junkyard and it should have some type of warranty.

David Neibert
07-22-2004, 07:21 AM
Don't worry about the supercharger...it's probably just a worn coupler. Unless it's spraying oil all over the motor just leave it alone.

I soulds lke there is air in your cooling system..with engine running (warm not hot) loosen the breather plug attached to the thermostat housing and wait until you see coolant running out (don't remove the plug just loosen 3 or 4 turns).

If your cooling issues don't improve it's easy to manually control the low speed fan without having to turn on the AC. Locate wire #14 on the ICRM (black box with a wire harness attached in front of air box and behind passengerside headlight) The plastic connector on the harness has the wire numbers listed. Cut #14....now the fan comes on and stays on. You just need to wire a switch inside of the car that connects and disconnects this wire to control the low speed fan.

David

porsche911
07-22-2004, 10:24 AM
Don't worry about the supercharger...it's probably just a worn coupler. Unless it's spraying oil all over the motor just leave it alone.

I soulds lke there is air in your cooling system..with engine running (warm not hot) loosen the breather plug attached to the thermostat housing and wait until you see coolant running out (don't remove the plug just loosen 3 or 4 turns).

If your cooling issues don't improve it's easy to manually control the low speed fan without having to turn on the AC. Locate wire #14 on the ICRM (black box with a wire harness attached in front of air box and behind passengerside headlight) The plastic connector on the harness has the wire numbers listed. Cut #14....now the fan comes on and stays on. You just need to wire a switch inside of the car that connects and disconnects this wire to control the low speed fan.

David


so if i am happy with the fan being on all the time (here in hawaii, its warm!) i can just clip wire 14 and protect the loose ends from contacting any ground and be done with the cooling woes?

kyle

XR7 Dave
07-22-2004, 10:48 AM
What you are doing is telling the IRCM that the EEC is no longer able to control the fan and you are putting the fan into "failure mode" and causing it to run all the time whenever the key is on regardless of anything. Just don't sit there with the key on and the engine not running or you will kill the battery. ;) For in town driving where temps are normally pretty warm, this may be a decent solution (even long term) for you on this one. At highway speeds the fan *may* become a cooling interference but I doubt it. Others have done this and not experienced any real problems.

As David said, I highly doubt that anything is seriously wrong with your supercharger. I've not met anyone who could accurately diagnose a bad SC bearing without dissasembly. Usually it's just a worn coupler or even a bad bearing in an idler sometimes.

porsche911
07-23-2004, 04:10 AM
you can check my other post, "what have i got to lose?" but id like to thank everyone here for the time and effort to get my bird back in flight.....ok so we dont really have lift off....but it can at least flap wings and run along the ground for now.

the fan has been modded with the common solution, cut wire 14.

the sc is still a bit loud but liveable for the time being until i get a used replacement or fix this one.

a few other small things popped up, but they were easy remedies.


again my thanks to all of you,

i owe you a beer!!

kyle