Not my day...

molson

Registered User
I've got one hell of an odd problem.

Here's the story:

Saturday morning, 6am. It had been snowing and blowing all night long, I've got to drive a friend of mine to Sea-Tac airport, he's got to be there by 11am. The temprature is about 27F.

I show up at my friends place, 15 minutes from my place, at 6am. I get out and leave the car running while I wait for him to quickly grab his things. We step out, hop in the car and go, no problems.
(Now keep in mind the roads are compact ice and snow, this includes all of I-5.)
We hit I-5, heading on our way, I realize I've got less than a quarter tank. We fill up... at Arco... I wasn't even fully awake when I came to notice the crap gas i just put in my tank. After I fill up, we grab more coffee and go.

Farther down the highway, around 7:30am, I gotta pee. So we pull into this rest area, I hop out, leave the car running while my buddy waits, hit the wizzer. Ahh, the higlight of my day.. Then the pee stopped and harsh reality started to set in when I notice my running engine missing from the surrounding ambient noise. I get out of the bathroom, look at my car, look at my buddy, "Dude, your car just died". "WTF", shoots through my head. I get in the car, turn the key "weow weow weow...weow weow weow...". No way...
"weow weow weow... weow weow weow...clickity clickity clickity.."

I tryed to start the car so many times, I drained the battery, or so I think. So I start checking plugs, hoses, fluids, etc.. I can't find a thing wrong.. Then the thought of bad gas, maybe a little water, hits my mind.. After two and a half hours in the cold, my buddy shows up from Blaine with some of that garbage isopropynol stuff. I pour in two bottles, 1 treats 10 gallons, into the tank. I wait about 20 minutes, have a smoke. Ok, let's start this thing. We hook up the jumpers to the car and my buddy's truck, "weow weow weow... weow weow weow..."

So we get into Seattle, get my buddy on the plane, call a tow truck and head back into Blaine. Tryed to jump it again once we got home.. same result with more clickity clickty...

My question:
My initial thought was water in the tank, this has been ruled out by the usage of gas water treatment.
The ignition? I've yet to test that theory. Is it true that the car would cut out if this fails?
Fuel pump? Nope, still hear it going.
Fuel Filter? Depends, is this easier to check than the ignition?
Battery? Light work fine. Everything that needs power works.

Please respond, I'm going stir crazy with out my beloved car. :(
I talked to my dad about this the other night, he thinks it may be a "crank shaft positioner sensor" I can't recall his exact words.
 
You said you filled it with bad gas? Did you use premium? If not I would drain it down and top it off with good fuel. Does the upshift light stay on while you are cranking the engine? Yes means it might be the crankshaft sensor. But I would bet its bad gas.

Maybe your Cam sensor. Maybe you got something wet with all the snow. Did you check you balancer? It goes on and on.
 
wezar said:
You said you filled it with bad gas? Did you use premium? If not I would drain it down and top it off with good fuel. Does the upshift light stay on while you are cranking the engine? Yes means it might be the crankshaft sensor. But I would bet its bad gas.

Maybe your Cam sensor. Maybe you got something wet with all the snow. Did you check you balancer? It goes on and on.
I did put in premium, it's just that I've heard Arco is notorious for watered down gas.
No upshift light. The entire engine compartment was dry as a bone.
 
Well then start with the obvious. connections, did you check the bolt in the vibration damper. Have you tried running codes?
 
It's not necesarily "Watered Down". The "Freeway" stations :rolleyes: buy the cr@p gas, or "Gas Cocktail" and sell it to you thinking you'll know no better, cause you are on the freeway and the car is hot and will burn this stuff up before you are any the wiser.
Take a bottle of what you drain out, cap it, and let it set undisturbed for a day. If you see layers of stuff, you can bet it's bad gas. They will take paint thinner, recycled (Somewhat filtered) paint, and anything else that is flammable liguid, and dilute with the gas, then sell to the cheaper freeway stations. I ALWAYS get gas IN TOWN now.

Along with Rick's suggestion about your CP Sensor and the upshift arrow when cranking...there is a schrader valve, next to the S/C on the front right side. Attach a fuel pressure guage to it and see if you have any fuel pressure. If not, it could be clogged filter, fuel pump went out, the fuel cutoff switch in the trunk, etc. Basically check the basics first before you go throwing sensors at it like I did....fuel, spark, good juice in the battery...etc. Maybe pull the easiest to get to :rolleyes: spark plug to see what it looks like as contaminents may be evident..
 
Maybe not the gas...???

molson said:
Thanks for the help guys, I'll check this stuff out tomorrow after work.

From what it sounds like, your engine loaded up and died, and wouldn't start because it was flooded. Now your plugs are probably fouled out. Your thermostat could be stuck open causing this condition in very cold weather. Did you upgrade your engine cooling system with a super efficent radiator? This will make the problem worse in such a situation. If you engine never reaches operating temperature, it messes up the fuel/air ratio, and the EEC has a real hard time adjusting under these conditions. At some point, the EEC will (not go bad) but just give up and shut everything down. Pull the codes, and then disconnect the battery for at least one minute. Reconnect the battery. Check for Spark, Air, and Fuel. Okay, try to start. If no spark, suspect CKP (crank shaft posistion) sensor full of crap or bad, or related component (the CMP) and/or circuit.

Good Luck.

disicpled1
 
Did you upgrade your engine cooling system with a super efficent radiator? This will make the problem worse in such a situation.


That statement is just plain old not true! :eek: :rolleyes:
 
Mike:
molson said:
Nope no upgrades, maybe I'll try your battery trick.

:D

I did the battery trick, no help. Checked my plugs, they seem fine. I'm going to check my fuel filter, see if that is clogged with stuff. Now that I think of it, since I've owned the car, I've never replaced that filter.
 
Fuel filter is a real easy job. 5 minutes if you stop for a beer. ;)
Come to think of it...I think it is the ONLY easy job on the SC.. :eek:
edit...keep in mind when you do re-fire the car, it may run rough for a few starts as the EEC re-learns the idle. That's normal..
 
Well, heres the story folks, get ready to laugh.


So, I go out and check my fuses for the second time, thinking maybe I missed something.

The second time around, I missed it again. My father is on his way from Abbotsford, he's the SC expert of the family. First thing he did, as expected, was check the fuses. "Hey Jay, you've got a blown fuse". OMFG.

Yup, my life was next to halted because of a blown fuel pump fuse.

Now, may the laughter commence.

As a note, the fuel filter was fine.
 
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You'll get no laughter from me! Been my experiance that usually its the smallest things that cause the biggest problems, but then again we're talking about an SC here so anything is possable.
Glad your up and running.............but I am still amazed that someone would think a higher perf rad would cause your problem. LOL!!!! :)
 
but I am still amazed that someone would think a higher perf rad would cause your problem. LOL!!!!

Ditto on that Mike. The radiator could cool the motor so good that the fan never comes on and it still wouldn't make the car run rich enough that it would load up with fuel and stall.

David

PS: Molsen...you might want to start planning to replace your fuel pump. There is usually a good reason why fuses blow...in your case I suspect a worn out pump that's pulling more amps than it should.
 
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David Neibert said:
PS: Molsen...you might want to start planning to replace your fuel pump. There is usually a good reason why fuses blow...in your case I suspect a worn out pump that's pulling more amps than it should.
Ya, I'll be doin that for sure. I hope it dosen't go out, dang pump is almost brand new.
 
Don't feel bad. My last hair-puller was #1 & #3 plug wires installed backwards after I checked them like 8 times! :eek: I was more attentive on making sure #4 & #5 were right as those were the "Weird" ones.
Time before that, I replaced almost every sensor and fuel injectors on my car before I got to a bad IAC valve :eek: :p .. "Live and learn while you have a few extra parts lying around just in case" is my new motto... :D
 
molson said:
Ya, I'll be doin that for sure. I hope it dosen't go out, dang pump is almost brand new.

Well if it's new then it's probably not the pump. For now I wouldn't do anything except carry a few spare fuses.

David
 
you got off easy... check me out, my car died after it was idlieng on my driveway, i couldnt hear the fuel pump, i panicked, ****, i tried turning the ignition again, i couldnt hear it, i panicked more, so i jack up the car, pull the gas tank, thinking the fuel pump went south, and it worked just fine, turns out it was the fuel pump relay in the trunk, boy did i feel stupid, yep start with the small things first, if you can afford it, get those fuses that light up when they burn out, might save you from getting a heart attack, or atleast wasting time, wish there was a MESSED UP RELAY light or something.
 
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