Tranny Issues.....

mlbuxbaum

Registered User
I have noticed that the tranny I just installed a week or so ago, will not go into "1" (don't really care unless it will hurt something) and when I shift from park to reverse or drive, it seems like the tranny will not engage until I give it some gas. Does that seem like an adjustment or something else all together?

PS - I have posted another issue I'm having with the car on here, and I wanted to re-ask for help with that issue as well.

Car runs fine till its warmed up, then it stalls when you come to a stop. Or when you shift out of park to either R or D. I checked the MAF, and it looks clean, check for vacuum leaks and can't find any, check IC tubes and they seem to be sealed ok, pulled codes and got left and right banks are lean. I got some help from "91disciple" I believe, and he said it is a fuel delivery issue most likely. He suggested I check and adjust the TPS. I don't know how to adjust it or check it. If you want further discussions on this the thread is entitled " Stalling after warmed up and other ???'s " in the technical forum. I really need help with this car as I will not have a garage to work on it in at the end of this month, and I cannot park it at my house without tags on it.
 
I'm not a trans expert, but maybe check the fluid level again, if it's off even a little sometimes that can make a big difference. Definately wouldn't hurt to chect the shifter and the throttle valve cable if your trans has one.

Kurt
 
Attention Sc Guru's !!

I figured out why the tranny would not go down into "1". :rolleyes: I took the console out, and the plate around the shift lever and I found about $3.00 in change wedged down in there. :eek: Removed the change, bought 2 sodas and it works now. The tranny also seems to go into R and D correctly now for some reason, I no longer have to give it some gas first. Go figure?!

I also think I found the vacuum leak some suggested I may have.The Lower IC Tube didn't look to be seated all the way. I loosened it up, put some RTV on the flange and re-sealed it up. Car idles smoother now, but I still have the stalling when warm issue going on. Here are some symptoms I noticed today. Car idles around 1000, put it into R and the rpm's go down to 500 or so, the oil pressure drops into the red and it stalls,( again my "upshift" light comes on when it stalls :confused: ). Sticker under the hood say the car should idle at 500 in Drive.
The bad motor mount suggestion is still sticking in my head, so I was watching the motor when I was shifting out of Park into R and my motor doesn't move at all. Not a millimeter. It also does not move when I goose it in gear. Are my motor mounts shot or are they pretty darn good? I don't know. I always thought the motor would move at least alittle when you goose it.
One of my guys here noticed someting I didn't....there is alot of water coming out of my exhaust and it is dripping out of the weep holes on the mufflers? What the heck is that a symptom of? Could it be from the car sitting for a couple months? I have ran the car down the road but no high speed highway stuff yet....yet....yet. I had the exhaust off to do the tranny and nothing leaked out then so I figure I have another motor issue. I smelled the "water" and it smells like, well, water with a hint of exhaust. Could that be another symptom of both banks running lean? The car idled in the garage here at work for half an hour and it didn't smell like a car was running in there, if you know what I mean. PLEASE PLEASE SOMEONE HELP ME. I'VE GOT ENOUGH GRAY HAIR AS IT IS.........This car is gunna drive me insane(r)

Lee "at my wits end" Buxbaum
 
mlbuxbaum said:
and I found about $3.00 in change wedged down in there. :eek: Removed the change, bought 2 sodas and it works now.
Soda must be expensive in your town ;)
mlbuxbaum said:
Car idles around 1000, put it into R and the rpm's go down to 500 or so, the oil pressure drops into the red and it stalls,( again my "upshift" light comes on when it stalls :confused: ). Sticker under the hood say the car should idle at 500 in Drive.
1000 is a bit high; you might want to check for vaccuum leaks around the throttle body. Easiest thing to do is to spray propane around the intake with the car idling and especially around the back of the intake where all the hoses connect and around every one of the IC tube joints. Including the one you resealed. Some people use starter fluid instead of propane. If you find a leak, the idle will jump up. The upshift after it stalls is normal. If it stays lit when you're cranking the engine, thats not normal.

If we don't find a leak, next we'll move onto the IAC.

mlbuxbaum said:
PLEASE PLEASE SOMEONE HELP ME. I'VE GOT ENOUGH GRAY HAIR AS IT IS.........This car is gunna drive me insane(r)

Lee "at my wits end" Buxbaum
SCCOA is Grecian formula for Supercoupe owners. :rolleyes:
 
Sounds like you still have a vacuum leak. The propane thing never worked good for me and I found it much easier to check for leaks by spraying all the IC tube and vacuum hose connections with carb cleaner while the engine is running.

If you have a leak, that would also explain the "lean" codes your getting. When operating under vacuum, such as idle or part throttle, unmetered air is entering the motor.

David
 
The propane test is even called for in my service manual, never worked for me either. I even did the propane thing directly into the TB and no change in idle or sound. I even tried starter fluid on the IC tubes, all 4 connections, around the back of the plenum, and nothing. I removed the TPS, and the IAC to inspect them and they "look" fine, nothing obviously broken on either one. I removed the MAF and looked at the sample tube and that looks fine as well. :( I'm really getting frustrated. It is gunna wind up being something really simple I know it. They are not that many vacuum lines on the car, I'm positive I'ver checked them all. I'm starting to think that since it only does it when the motor is warm, its a metal expansion thing causing the leak. I was reading around the forums about checking the TPS voltage, they said to check voltage on the green wire, well I don't have a green wire. I have a grey/red, a grey/white and a brown/white. I'm off the the parts store & junk yard to see waht other parts I can scrounge, and stop worrying about this issue for a little while.
 
Low Voltage to the MAF and TPS DTC codes

The codes you presented were DTC 122 and DTC 157.
DTC 122 Throtle Positon Sensor (TPS) voltage lower than expected.
DTC 157 Mass Air Folw (MAF) sensor below minimum voltage.

These componets could very well be good, just not getting the proper supply voltage!

First check the battery for proper charge/voltage.

With Engine Running:

MAF:
Check between terminals A and B for at least 10.5 volts.
Check between terminal C and D for 0.60 volts at idle.

Key on Only:

TPS:
Check between the grey/white stripe wire, and the brown/white striped wires. At idle, voltage should be 0.80 volts.

Note: On my car, I had to put a cressent wrench adjusted to fit tightly over the flat part of the throttle plate cam that fits into the TPS and ever so slightly twist it clockwise when facing from the drivers side looking at the TB. It had to move may be .010 to bring it down to 0.80, as my TPS sensor is non-adjustable and was reading quite high. I determined that the cam had twisted from a heavy foot on the gas peddle. More on this in another post.
 
discipled1

Thanks for all your input, it has been most helpful. No one has addressed the issue of all the water coming out of the exhaust yet. Do you have any suggestions or thoughts :confused: I'm going to be checking TPS voltages this morning, I've got the battery disconnected right now, to reset the EEC. Then I'm gunna try the idle re-learn.
The car was idling yesterday at 750 or so and, for a little while, would only stumble and sputter when dropped into gear but not stall. But it eventually started stalling. Its not a graceful stall either, it sounds hard and rough.
One last question.. the top radiator hose and the radiator get hot as you know what, like the t-stat isn't opening, but the car doesn't get hot(according to the gauge)(and it doesn't smell like its running hot if you know what I mean)
 
Check TPS and MAF

per your direction

Battery charges at 14.35 volts,

MAF
terminals a-b = 14.1 volts at idle
terminals c-d = .825 volts at idle

TPS
grey/white - brown/white = 4.07 volts at idle. I double checked it with another multimeter to be sure

in your post you indicate the following, which is confusing.....if it is Key on Only how can it be idling?

Key on Only:

TPS:
Check between the grey/white stripe wire, and the brown/white striped wires. At idle, voltage should be 0.80 volts.

Note: On my car, I had to put a cressent wrench adjusted to fit tightly over the flat part of the throttle plate cam that fits into the TPS and ever so slightly twist it clockwise when facing from the drivers side looking at the TB. It had to move may be .010 to bring it down to 0.80, as my TPS sensor is non-adjustable and was reading quite high. I determined that the cam had twisted from a heavy foot on the gas peddle. More on this in another post.
 
mlbuxbaum said:
TPS
grey/white - brown/white = 4.07 volts at idle. I double checked it with another multimeter to be sure

in your post you indicate the following, which is confusing.....if it is Key on Only how can it be idling?
Try running w/o the TPS connected. Just unplug it and see how things go. You may get a check engine light, but this should at least let you know if its the cause of the idle problem.

As for the water, some water out the exhaust is normal, if you're not loosing coolant, I don't know what it would be.
 
I'll try disconnecting the TPS and see how it goes. As far as the exhaust....its not some water...its quite a bit...I could put a glass under it and collect it. I'm not losing coolant, but I did check it and there is ALOt of debris in it so I'm going to flush it tonight and refill. Thnaks for the input.
 
Last edited:
Bad news

I may be wrong, but I think you have a cracked head. #1 reason- you say possibly t stat isn't opening, but your temp gauge reads normal. Theres air in the cooling system which explains a false reading on the gauge. #2 reason- spitting water out of the tailpipes. Your head may be cracked on the exhaust side, which will promote coolant loss, but wont burn it. Double check your coolant level. If your t stat stuck closed, chances are the engine overheated, cracking the head. If not the head, then its a head gasket. The rough idle could be caused by loss of compression via cracked head/gasket Good luck, JJ
Also, does the radiator fan turn on when the engine warms up at idle? It should.
 
Last edited:
At Idle

"in your post you indicate the following, which is confusing.....if it is Key on Only how can it be idling?[/QUOTE]"

My bad. I meant that you can check it with key on and/or with engine running at idle.
 
DTC's 122,157,Possible Restriced Exhaust,Mal.Fnc.02Sensor,Int.Man.Leak?

The test results are all within range, so that's good. The MAF sensor is slightly high, but that voltage can vary due to load and ambient temp.

(Assuming that everything else is in good working order as you stated)

The water coming out the exhaust is "normal" to a point. A lean running engine will produce more O2 (according to my G1 instructor). With more 02 available in the exhaust, the possibility of increased formation of H20. However, if there is back pressure in the exhaust, and then a spot where pressure drops rapidly (i.e. a pronounced restriction in the exhaust), the temp. of the gases will drop accordingly. With the temp. drop, can come the formation of excess water in the exhaust due to condensation. Normally, the heat of the exhaust system will prevent formation of water droplets and keep the H20 in the form of steam. However, under normal conditions, you will only see this steam in very cold climates where it condenses as it reaches the atmosphere outside the exhaust system. On a normal car, a few drops here and there are normal, but water that seems to come in a constant stream indicates that something is causing the exhaust gases to cool down too much before exiting the exhaust system. One things that comes to mind would be a plugged CAT, but it could be any one of the components in the exhaust. For instance, if your exhaust output is far in excess of the exhaust systems capability to handle, then this too will cause your problem.

With regard to engine coolant being the cause of the water in the exhaust, from what I've read on the net recently, you would be smelling a distinct "sweet" smell from the antifreeze, and you would be loosing coolant from the engines cooling system at a rate that would be noticeable (under most common conditions!).

A more realistic problem would be that the intake manifold is leaking both coolant and vacuum. The coolant loss would be hard to detect, and vacuum would get slightly better, or slightly worse (+1-3 lbs.) as engine warms up, depending on how the seal between the intake and head are reacting to engine heat. In this case, replacing the intake manifold gasket and torquing the intake manifold PROPERLY will prevent future leaks. I believe this was a TBS for service techs. If the intake manifold is not torqued properly, it WILL leak!


Best to do a back pressure test of the exhaust system at the O2 sensor.

As far as the DTC's of 122 and 157 for low voltage to the MAF and TPS, I think you've determined that these components and their supplied voltages are good.

You should test the O2 sensors while your at it, as they too can contribute to the problem if not functioning properly.

Also, there is an adjustment (on mine anyway) of the TB for the IAC. Under a small rubber plug is a torx adjusting screw. It works in relation to the IAC's inlet air feed. I adjusted mine by first determining its position. Started that engine, and at operating temp., adjusted the screw like this:

Move throttle linkage by hand to raise rpm to between 1500-2000 rpms and then let go.

listen for rpm to drop smoothly back to idle.
If RPM is held up at some point and then drops to idle, then adjust the screw to eliminate this uneven transition in RPM.

After re-reading your previous post, you mentioned that the top radiator hose get really hot, but that the engine is not running hot. A lean condition with a could cooling system is my guess. Cylinder heads are getting very hot and causing problems with combustion. This would be in line with an intake manifold gasket leak, and possibly a thermostat that does not have a bleeder orifice positioned at between 12 O'clock and 3pm.

Geezshes, this is a really long post so to sum things up:

First things first,
1. check the thermostat for proper position and that no air is trapped in the cooling system.
2. Since you have the thermostat out, remove the intake and replace the gaskets.
3. With the intake out, check the fuel rail pressure (too low will cause lean condition).
4. Your DTC's of 122 and 157 are a result of the PCM trying to adjust fuel trim that was out of range of the sensors. A lean condition is due to un-metered air getting into the intake system. That's why the intake gasket replacement. You will have to remove and reinstall everything in the intake system and this will help get ride of any unknowns.

5. Check the exhaust and 02 sensors, as they are the other half of the the intake system.

6. While you have the intake manifold off, remove and reinstall the CPS just to be sure its not off a tooth. I know there is a fudge factor, but get it exact.

7. With the intake and IC tube off, pressure check your IC cooler, and reseal the IC tubes. I used plumbers Teflon tape (thick), and some spray adhesive to hold the tape in place. Apply the tape to the male ends of the IC components. Small wrinkles will not be a problem after tightening down. Be sure to re tighten all the joints after waiting 10 minutes.

8. After testing/reassembling everything properly, start and warm the engine to operating temp. Then do an idle relearn by cycling from park to drive, and waiting in each for idle and smoothness to adjust, with out touching the gas pedal.

At this point, your problem with lean banks and poor idle should be gone.

Clear codes and perform KOER, and or drive the car for awhile and see how it runs, and if any DTC are generated.
 
Last edited:
I'll double, triple check the intake bolts here in few minutes. Getting ready to pull it into the garage now.
 
mlbuxbaum said:
I'll double, triple check the intake bolts here in few minutes. Getting ready to pull it into the garage now.

Cool, but it's not enought to simply retighten the bolts to torque spec. You have to do it like it states in the manual for torquing the intake down. I think it says in 3 steps, and in a specific order. And yes you will need a new gasket, and a dab of rtv sealant in the corners as per mfg reccomendation.. Remember that any head surfacing work can lead to improper angle in the intake side of the head. You'll be able to chech this by simply placing the intake in the valley, and look at the angle of the head mating surface and the angle of the intake surface. Let me know how it goes.

P.S. You should re-read my previous post, as I've been at it for a while now and have edited it a few times, trying to be a clear as possible and not write someting that is incorrect (hard for me, because I can't spell :D )
 
discipled1 said:
In this case, replacing the intake manifold gasket and torqueing the intake manifold PROPERLY will prevent future leaks. I believe this was a TBS for service techs. If the intake manifold is not torqued properly, it WILL leak!
Torquing the intake took me longer than I expected. Took about 5 passes going in the criss-cross sequence provided in the Haynes manual and that was to the 11-15 lbs or so of torque. Each time it seemed like they weren't as tight as they were on the prior pass, but eventually they settled in. That was using the blue gaskets from the Felpro set.
 
discipled1 - went back and re-read your post again. There is alot of info in there for anyone having a problem. Great work. I did torque the bolts according to the manual with a torque wrench when I re-installed it, so I don't think thats they issue. I did use the fel pro kit with all the new gaskets and such. I disconnected the TPS and it seemed to do better, and yeah the CEL came on. I changed out the IAC for another one and it seems to work much better now. :D :D I'm getting ready to take it out for a spin, I'll post back when I return.......if no post in 1/2 hour....it didn't work and I'm calling AAA.
 
We really need to rename this thread

discipled1 - just got back from an incredible test ride......WOW, Double WOW even...this car is a blast to drive. Okay, I'm done being excited.....not. :D Okay some issues with the test drive.
First...no stalling at lights !!!! :D :D idle settled in at about 750 I guess.
Second...When I would slow down for a light, rpms would fall like usual but when the tranny would downshift, the rpms would go up then back down. Is that normal....I don't think it is.
Third....Threw a CEL while driving, stayed on for a while then went out. Came back on and did the same thing. Pulled it in the garage, and pulled the code. I got the following;
121
upshift light came on, stayed on
digital display on heater started dimly flashing
no more codes were given...ever

turned car off, re-tested, same thing happened.
Any ideas?

The car didn't overheat at all, in fact it was blowing hot air, 80 degrees to be exact (as exact as a Ford can be), and the temp gauge stayed pretty low. It climbed up towards the middle a few times but went right back down when I took off. I think she just wanted to be ran for a bit....... ;)
 
Last edited:
Back
Top