Rebuilding Motor

90XR7Cougar5spd

Registered User
I am fixing to pull the motor out of my cougar and rebuild it, when i finally got it running i had a rod knocking.. I need to know where do you guys get all your parts from to do a rebuild i am gonna put all new bearings in the motor, bore it out, and would like to get the blower ported..... What im wanting is something that i can drive everyday one the street but when i take it to the track i wanna turn some decent times, i would like to get to atleast 13-14. If anyone could help me with the info i would appreciate it, also i would like to know how much you guys put into your motor when you rebuilt it.


Thanks

Derek
 
If you've got a rod knocking you're going to need a crank. If you get that one turned down don't build it up and race it. I've heard too many stories of turned down cranks breaking.
 
Mike Puckett said:
If you've got a rod knocking you're going to need a crank. If you get that one turned down don't build it up and race it. I've heard too many stories of turned down cranks breaking.


Ok this is going to sound like a stupid question but if ive got a rod knowcking why would i need a new crank????
 
In the cases that I know of the knock has been caused by a spun rod bearing which severely scores and ruins the crank rod journal. I've seen this at least 3 times and it's been the #2 and #4 rod journal although I guess any of them could go bad. This is what happened on my original motor. They can be turned but that tends to weaken them a bit. If turned they have to be done with particular attention to proper radiusing on the sides of the journals. I had one repaired with a cold hard chrome plating process by Crankshaft Specialists in Memphis for $525 which returned it to the original specs. You can't get a new crank but there are plenty of used ones out there. Just be sure it isn't damaged.
 
The crank can be turned .010 and thats it any more then that and you should try and source a good used one. I dont know if you can have a forged crank fillet (sp) its were they roll the edges of the bearing surfaces to reduse stress risers. Talk to Mic he is a great guy and will help you pic the parts for your car. Most other parts like gaskets and bearings can be had at AutoZone.
 
90XR7Cougar5spd said:
I am fixing to pull the motor out of my cougar and rebuild it, when i finally got it running i had a rod knocking.. I need to know where do you guys get all your parts from to do a rebuild i am gonna put all new bearings in the motor, bore it out, and would like to get the blower ported..... What im wanting is something that i can drive everyday one the street but when i take it to the track i wanna turn some decent times, i would like to get to atleast 13-14. If anyone could help me with the info i would appreciate it, also i would like to know how much you guys put into your motor when you rebuilt it.


Thanks

Derek
I like www.rockauto.com and www.summitracing.com
 
Yeah, i work at autozone and was going to try to get gasket and bearings and other things there but i wasnt real sure about pistons, rings, rods, and other "moving" parts
 
I checked both of those sites and was unable to come up with a crank for the 3.8. I also could not find forged pistons for us.

Chris
 
Anyone have any clue how much the machine work is going to cost, im going to bore it out have new bearings installed, and have the heads completely redone.....

Thanks
Derek
 
125.00 Disassemble Engine

· 60.00 Vat Clean Block

· 120.00 Bore & Power Hone to .040

· 175.00 Bore & power Hone With Torque Plate to .040

· 208.00 Bore & Hone With Plate Over.040

· 145.00 Bore & Hone Without Plate Over .040

· 62.50 Power Hone ( w/ Sunnen Machine)

· 120.00 Power Hone With Torque Plate (w/ Sunnen Machine)

· 43.75 Flex Hone

· 120.00 Sleeve Cylinder

· 90.00 Mill Block ($2.00/.001, After.010) (V8)

· 90.00 Mill Intake Manifold (V8)

· 250.00 Machine O Ring Grove

· Time - Cut Block for Rod Clearance

· 37.50 Install Cam Bearings

· 30.00 Check Line Bore

· 187.50 Align Bore

· 62.50 Magnaflux Crankshaft

· 56.25 Polish Crankshaft

· 106.25 Grind Crankshaft (Stock Stroke)

· 2.00 Replace Soft Plugs (Ea.)

· 81.25 Pressure Test for Cracks

· 30.00 Mic Crankshaft

· 137.50 Cross Drill Crankshaft

· Time - Offset Grind Crankshaft

· 30.00 Chamfer Oil Holes (Crank Not Ground BY US)

· 156.25 Fill With Grout & Tap Bolt Holes

· 562.50 Machine & Install Roller Cam Bearings

· 690.00 Machine & Install Lifter Bushings

· 143.75 Debur Block

30.00 Clean Crankshaft











BALANCING



· 180.00 Internal V-8 (Less Damper & Flywheel)

· 245.00 External V-8

· 120.00 Inline 4 & 6 Cylinder

· 60.00 Flywheel

· 7.50 Piston (Ea.) (Odd Pistons By Hourly Rate)

· 7.50 Rod (Ea.) (Odd Rods By Hourly Rate)

· 62.50 Install Mallory Metal (Per 1" Hole) (Plus Metal)

· 50.00 Install Mallory Metal (Per 3/4 Hole) (Plus Metal)

· Time - Weld Counterweights (30.00 Min.)

· Time - Neutral Balance External Flywheel



CONNECTING RODS



· 3.75 Check Bore Size

· 15.00 Check & Resize (Per Rod)

· 20.00 Check & Resize Big Rod (Per Rod)

· 18.75 Chamfer Bolt Holes For SPS Bolts (8)

· 180.00 Bore Small End For Bushings (Equalized)

· 11.25 Install Bushings (Ea.)

· 60.00 Fit For Floated Pins

· 90.00 Mill To Set Side Clearance

· 125.00 Grind & Polish Beams

· Time - Cut for Crankshaft Clearance





PISTONS

· 10.00 Press Off & Replace (Per Rod)

· 60.00 Hone For Pins

· 60.00 Check Comp. Dist. (Ea.)

· 120.00 Flycut Intake Or Exhaust Valve Reliefs (8)

· 180.00 Flycut Compound Angle (Time)

· 120.00 Machine Domes (8)

· Time Blend Domes

· (2) 75.00 Check Piston - To - Valve Clearance

· 30.00 Disassemble Floating Type (8)

· 60.00 Assemble Floating Type (8)





FINAL ASSEMBLY

· (3) 60.00 Hand Clean Soap & Water

· (4)150.00 Set Deck Clearance (Milling Included Up To .050)

· (5) 180.00 Set Ring End Gap

· (6) 60.00 Check Main Bear. Clearance

· (7) 60.00 Check Rod Bear. Clearance

· (8) 60.00 Degree Camshaft

· (9) 60.00 Check Rod To Cam Clearance

· 200.00 Assemble Short Block

· 350.00 Assemble Long Block

· 500.00 Assemble Complete Engine

· (Assembly Only) Does Not Include 1-9 Or Any Other Machine Work



Cylinder Head Porting

· 375.00 (Typ.) Street/Strip (Bowl Area cleanup, Gasket Match )

· 750.00 (Typ.) 5 Axis CNC Porting only (with existing program)

· 1200.00-2000.00 (Avg.) Full Competition ( CNC Bowls, Runners, Chambers with hand finishing )



· 75.00 (Per Hour) Flow Testing, SuperFlow 600

· 75.00 (Per Hour) Cylinder head development, Digitizing and CAD/CAM Service.



Cylinder Heads

· 30.00 Clean Heads (V8)

· 60.00 Pressure Test For Cracks (V8)

· 30.00 Clean Heads (V8)

· 100.00 Precision Valve Job (3 Angle)

· 185.00 Competition Valve Job (Angles + Radius)

· 62.50 Flat Mill (To.010) (V8)

· 2.50 Mill, Per.001 After.010

· 118.75 Mill For Compression (Typ.V8)

· 218.75 Angle Mill Head (To. I 00)

· 250.00 Cut O Ring Receiver Grooves

· 32.00 CC Combustion Chamber (100.00 Per 8)

· 50.00 Machine Spring Seats

· 30.00 Check Cam Line Bore

· 43.75 Machine Guides For Seals

· 121.88 Install Guides Per 16 (30.00 Ea.)

· 60.00 Hone Valve Guides

· 100.00 Install/Replace Seats, Iron Head (Per 8)

· 25.00 Install I Seat, 10.00 Ea. Additional, Iron Head

· 60.00 Replace 1 Seat, 10.00 Each After, Aluminum (Ea.)

· 105.00 Cut For Over Size Valves (Per 16)

· 68.75 Cut For Over Size Valves (Per 8)

· 120.00 Machine & Install Screw-In Studs

· 43.75 Correct Spring Height (Included With Valve Job)

· 40.00 Knurl Guides (Per 16)

· 62.50 Debur Head (Ea.)

· 75.00 Assemble Cylinder Heads

· All Valve Jobs Include Vacuum Testing To Ensure Seal


Miscellaneous

· 60.00 /Hour Misc. Shop Work

· 90.00 Flow Test Carb. (20.00 Ea. Additional Test)

· 45.00 Grind Flywheel

· 60.00 / Hour Lathe & Mill Work

· 90.00 (Type.) Rework Carb. (Holley Type)

· 75.00 Mill Carb Choke Horn

· 30.00 Install Time Sert (EA.)

· 80.00 / Hour Dynamometer Time (500.00 Min.)

· SuperFlow 901T 2000 HP, Computerized Facility

COY MILLER RACE ENGINES
1046 Moore Street
HARRISONBURG VA. 22802
Coy Miller
Phone 540-433-0545
 
I tired to deal with local garages and if its not a chevy 350 they have no idea how to work on it. After i found out how close Coy Miller was i loaded up the block and parts and took everything to him. His prices were lower then the idiots around me and unlike the locals he knows what a SC is and has the torque plate for one. Also the machinery he has is much newer and better mantained then the junk in my area. It cost me $600 to have him tank the block, bore .020 hoan with torque plate, install cam bearings, install soft plugs, balance assembly, chamfer 351 rod bearings, and deck it. He is a great person and am very glad i got to talk to him, well worth the 1200 miles and a speeding ticket. All i can say is check out the garage you plan to have the work done in, if its a mess i walk away.
 
When I spoke to Coy Miller's shop, that told me they turn all of the SC cranks .010 just FYI...

My crank is beign turned as well becasue I went through this question befoe and decided from all the post at that time that .010 was gonna have to do...

Is it likely that one can have the crank re-heat treated locally???

That is the problem, correct, the factory hardness is "shallow"?
 
The stock cranks are not heat treated. This is what a local machinest told me that looked at my uncut crank. Like i said the best thing for strength is rolled fillets (sp) but i dont know if you can do that on a forged crank. The Chevy 2.8 cranks are noduler iron and if you dont rolle the fillets after you grind the crank they will snap unsally under 10k miles. If you are only cutting .010 dont worry about the crank, i tore a few Jasper type rebuilt SC motors and they have been turned .020 and even they lasted a long time.
 
Well i dont think me going to coy miller to have him do my machine work is practical, i just looked it up on mapquest, its 1131.15 miles and 17 hours 48 min. just one way. No way i would make that in one day, i drove straight from billings montana to tulsa oklahoma once, bout killed myself a few time. When coming back from Martinez cali, to tulsa okla, we drove straight through but switch drivers a few times, i would more than likely be by myself, then i would have to get a motel room and wait for it to get done, i hate motel rooms so very much, last job i had i traveld a lot and thats all i ever seen was motel rooms. Wish i lived closer i would love to have him to my machine work, but luckily i have heard of a few good machine shops in this area that work on race motors alot, but yet i doubt they have worked on a SC motor well looks like i aint got much of a choice. Anywho,

Thanks for the info

Derek


PS anyone near tulsa oklahoma have any good machine shops to recomend??????
 
90XR7Cougar5spd said:
Well i dont think me going to coy miller to have him do my machine work is practical, i just looked it up on mapquest, its 1131.15 miles and 17 hours 48 min. just one way. No way i would make that in one day, i drove straight from billings montana to tulsa oklahoma once, bout killed myself a few time. When coming back from Martinez cali, to tulsa okla, we drove straight through but switch drivers a few times, i would more than likely be by myself, then i would have to get a motel room and wait for it to get done, i hate motel rooms so very much, last job i had i traveld a lot and thats all i ever seen was motel rooms. Wish i lived closer i would love to have him to my machine work, but luckily i have heard of a few good machine shops in this area that work on race motors alot, but yet i doubt they have worked on a SC motor well looks like i aint got much of a choice. Anywho,

Thanks for the info

Derek


PS anyone near tulsa oklahoma have any good machine shops to recomend??????

I remember someone one here having a torque plate they bought and was loaning it out to poeple. It would be worth it to see if you can contact that person and see if you can borrow it for you'r motor.
 
BKB said:
I remember someone one here having a torque plate they bought and was loaning it out to poeple. It would be worth it to see if you can contact that person and see if you can borrow it for you'r motor.


Not to sound like an idiot, ive dont lots of work on many different cars but this is my first engine rebuild, but what is the torque plate??????? :confused:


Thanks Derek
 
For the SC its a huge chunk of alluminum that you bolt on like a head. You bolt it down like you would a normal head with gasket and torque to spec. This distortes the block=cylinder walls just as if the motor was assembled. You do this while honing so the cylinders are round when there is a head bolted down. It is to help promote better ring seal.
 
Put it this way...when you bolt your heads down, this ensures that the bores are stright because they already were TORQUED with the PLATE during the machining process. If you do not use a plate then the bores will flex a bit during assembly.

Chris
 
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