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007_SuperCoupe
08-10-2006, 02:19 PM
I just thought I post this out here.

I'm looking at the possibility of having some ford 3.8l oversized valves made so we are not having to use SBC valves in our heads. I know that they work, but still they are not designed for our heads.

I'm just wondering if there would be any more interest out there for these other than myself. I'm going to be making a call to the manufacturer in the next few days to see how many need to be made to make a "production run" of them to keep the price down for them.

I'm currently considering the SBC head sizes of 1.840" for the intake and 1.600" for the exhaust so new seats don't have to be installed in the heads.

This thread is obviously intended for those who are looking at getting oversized valve heads or those who port them. Please let me know if there's any interest out there for these.

XR7 Dave
08-10-2006, 02:46 PM
I just thought I post this out here.

I'm looking at the possibility of having some ford 3.8l oversized valves made so we are not having to use SBC valves in our heads. I know that they work, but still they are not designed for our heads.

I'm just wondering if there would be any more interest out there for these other than myself. I'm going to be making a call to the manufacturer in the next few days to see how many need to be made to make a "production run" of them to keep the price down for them.

I'm currently considering the SBC head sizes of 1.840" for the intake and 1.600" for the exhaust so new seats don't have to be installed in the heads.

This thread is obviously intended for those who are looking at getting oversized valve heads or those who port them. Please let me know if there's any interest out there for these.

1) the intake seats are 1.860 in diameter so that is the largest valve you would want to run on them.

2) the exhaust seats are 1.565 in diameter so that is the largest valve you would want to run on them.

Overall length of the Chevy valves is slight longer than stock 3.8, but by the time you raise the seats in the process of cutting the larger diameter, you effectively nullify the longer length. Typically SBC valves install at the stock overall height making them a direct drop in.

Since SBC valves are already available in 1.840 and 1.560 diameters, there really is no purpose for a new valve IMO.

007_SuperCoupe
08-10-2006, 08:57 PM
1) the intake seats are 1.860 in diameter so that is the largest valve you would want to run on them.

2) the exhaust seats are 1.565 in diameter so that is the largest valve you would want to run on them.

Overall length of the Chevy valves is slight longer than stock 3.8, but by the time you raise the seats in the process of cutting the larger diameter, you effectively nullify the longer length. Typically SBC valves install at the stock overall height making them a direct drop in.

Since SBC valves are already available in 1.840 and 1.560 diameters, there really is no purpose for a new valve IMO.

So, you're not interested then?

I'm looking into options that are not currently available. Yes, SBC valves are available that work, but if there were SC specific valves available (at around the same price) would anyone be interested in purchasing them? ...that's what I'm asking.

Again, I'm looking at getting 1.840" intake and 1.600" exhaust valves made. The exhaust can have a 1.600" valve since the seat outside diameter is 1.625". I'm not trying to argue the point, but I've got a head right now that has 1.600" exhaust valves cut on a stock seat. I'm not saying it is easy, but it is entirely possible to be done.

XR7 Dave
08-10-2006, 09:36 PM
What would these valves be made out of?

007_SuperCoupe
08-10-2006, 10:16 PM
I'm looking at the Ferrea 5000 series or 6000 series valves which are both forged stainless steel.

We really don't need anything more than either of those because our engines just aren't capable of the performance that would suggest the use of more "high tech" valves than that.

XR7 Dave
08-10-2006, 10:59 PM
I'm looking at the Ferrea 5000 series or 6000 series valves which are both forged stainless steel.

We really don't need anything more than either of those because our engines just aren't capable of the performance that would suggest the use of more "high tech" valves than that.

The 6000 series valve is stainless EV-8 which should be considered minimum for an exhaust valve. The 5000 series is 21-N2 which is a lower grade stainless and is good for an intake valve.

I'm not sure everyone would agree with your assertion that our engines aren't capable of the performance that would suggest a higher grade valve. Average exhaust temps under boost conditions do exceed 1300 deg on average with peak being over 1400deg at max rpm. Ask your valve supplier what they think about that.

I guess the real question is, how would these valves be different from what is already available?

007_SuperCoupe
08-11-2006, 07:54 AM
I guess the real question is, how would these valves be different from what is already available?

Some of the angles that are made on the valve during the forging process (meaning that they can't be cut on the valve later) will be different than your standard off the shelf valve to promote better low and mid range flow.

XR7 Dave
08-11-2006, 10:32 PM
Some of the angles that are made on the valve during the forging process (meaning that they can't be cut on the valve later) will be different than your standard off the shelf valve to promote better low and mid range flow.

Well, you know we all want the best, so how much is this going to cost us and when are they going to be available? If the product is good I'll be first in line to buy some.

007_SuperCoupe
08-11-2006, 11:24 PM
Well, you know we all want the best, so how much is this going to cost us and when are they going to be available? If the product is good I'll be first in line to buy some.

The intention of this post was to see if there was any interest beyond the valves I am going to get for my SC. I have not contacted Ferrea yet because of reasons that are beyond my control, but I will be in the coming days.

Any order that is placed for these valves will be ready within days according to Ferrea, so there should be no or very little delay time. I just need to see how large of an initial production run is required to get the price to a reasonable level (instead of around $20 per valve guestimate). But I want to know if it is even worth asking before I ask it. Hence this thread.

XR7 Dave
08-12-2006, 07:32 AM
I'd really like to know exactly what it is about these valves that would make them better than what is already available.

Also, I can't use a 1.600" valve as the stock SC seat is only 1.565". I don't know who told you they were 1.625" but that is just plain wrong. 1.625" is the largest diameter seat that you can put in, not the diameter of the stock seat. When we say "stock seat" diameter, we mean that is the absolute outside diameter of the steel seat. Any bigger and you are out on the aluminum and not on the seat anymore so if you have a 1.600" valve made, that means in order to use it one would have to install new seats which dramatically increases the cost of the heads and also increases the possibility of other problems making it not a worthwhile operation for me or my customers. FWIW my motor runs on stock exhaust seats as do all Steig heads.

I would be very interested in buying valves right away but they have to be correct for my application so you'd have to post complete specs. I need several sets but could not commit unless I am certain they are what I can use and at a price I can afford.

The problem with getting anyone to commit to something like this is that 99% of the people don't know exactly what it is that they need. No one wants to order a custom anything if they don't know for sure that it will fit. Add to that the fact that most people don't actually do this kind of work themselves and you'll end up with a very non-committal response.

Randy N Connie
08-12-2006, 09:23 AM
I may be interrested
Material type?
Are they one peice or the standard welded two peice valve?
regular stem diameter or thin stem?
picture to see back shape? exhaust and intake.
is the valve face straight or dished
Valve length total
valve length from face to keeper collar.
is the backcut standard 45 degree or more than one backcut angle?
what Is the valve face edge cuts straight or a radius shape?
Valve weight.

Randy

007_SuperCoupe
08-12-2006, 09:50 AM
I may be interrested
Material type?
Are they one peice or the standard welded two peice valve?
regular stem diameter or thin stem?
picture to see back shape? exhaust and intake.
is the valve face straight or dished
Valve length total
valve length from face to keeper collar.
is the backcut standard 45 degree or more than one backcut angle?
what Is the valve face edge cuts straight or a radius shape?
Valve weight.

Randy

I don't have all the answers for you at this time Randy. Some of the items won't be known really until they are made (weight for example). I'll do what I can to get answers to some of your questions in the next week or two.

Right now, these valves are not being made. I am simply attempting to see if it is worth it to the community to see if Ferrea will add a valve to their catalog for us. I'm getting my own set of valves even if I have to pay $20/valve. I simply thought that the rest of the community might be interested.


David, I don't want to get into an arguement with you about these valves. A 1.600" exhaust valve CAN be cut onto a stock seat. I've got a head to prove it. Even if you were to have to install a new seat, you're talking $10 per seat (at least that's what it'll cost me) so you're talking $60 more for the heads than before. That isn't a significant cost to the heads. If you are not interested in the 1.600" exhaust valves, then fine. I don't really care either way.

Randy N Connie
08-12-2006, 12:37 PM
I have a set of Ferrea IN , EX valves for one of my SC 3.8 heads.
They are nice looking, but have never compaired them in one set
of heads ,to another valve like a Manley valve..
To see if they have better flow.

The next set of valves I plan to buy for a SC 3.8 head will be
titanium.

On my list above is just some things to think about when buying
a valve.

Good luck
Randy

Jason Wild
08-12-2006, 07:04 PM
Intresting idea but i'm not sure the 5000 and 6000 Series velves are right for the SC. I was talking to one of the tec. at ferrea and he said for the motor I plan to build the Super Alloy Valves would be the best and if $$$ does not mater then Titanium.

Still would like to hear more on what you find out.

007_SuperCoupe
08-13-2006, 06:51 PM
Randy,
I'm working closely with a very competent machinist and all the areas you addressed earlier in this thread had already been answered before you addressed them. I just don't have all those answers in front of me now. The end product will be worth it, I'm just not sure where it'll end at.

Jason,
The Super Alloy may in fact what we end up going with...starting point was simply 5000/6000 series valves. We have yet to talk to a Ferrea tech about what my end goals are, etc so we may not end up with the 6000 series at all.