FMIC vs. Double IC

AMD[H]unter

Registered User
I got a question for yall. I am debating going to a double intercooler, but I am also considering a FMIC. My question is, what is the HP difference between a FMIC and a double IC with a fan on it? Does anyone have any numbers or suggestions?
 
AMD[H]unter said:
I got a question for yall. I am debating going to a double intercooler, but I am also considering a FMIC. My question is, what is the HP difference between a FMIC and a double IC with a fan on it? Does anyone have any numbers or suggestions?

I gained 16 rwhp switching from an ESM dbl IC with fan, to a Magnum Powers FMIC. That was when I was using a ported early model blower....probably would have been more with an MPII or S port.

David
 
You will give up with the Front mount..Ac performance will suffer as will engine temperature...But yes you will get more power...Its a give take thing...Double IC may give you a bit more power but how much I dunno..
 
Aight, thanks for the info, guys! I think I might be leaning towards the Double IC with fan, just because my car is a daily driver (gotta have cold air and engine temps here in AL), and the price difference is so much more.
 
I installed a MP FMIC and a MPIII . And I picked up 15.4 rwhp.

The only gain I see .Is that my RWHP does not go up
and down as much when seasons change from hot to cold.

The MP FMIC made my motor temps raise slightly.

I had a MPII blower and stock IC system before swap
and had 250.0 RWHP

Randy
 
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Pablo94SC said:
$1200 for 15-16rwhp is pretty pricey if you ask me.
True, but the potential is there for bigger gains as you increase the mods to your engine / blower. I suspect bigger gains on built engines w/ ported or aftermarket blowers.

Regardless, I doubt I would get the MP FMIC because I refuse to sacrifice my AC in the summer.
 
AMD[H]unter said:
Aight, thanks for the info, guys! I think I might be leaning towards the Double IC with fan, just because my car is a daily driver (gotta have cold air and engine temps here in AL), and the price difference is so much more.

Get one with a shroud for you fan. Check out the Dbl ICs out there. Some have better features than others

Ken
 
Pablo94SC said:
$1200 for 15-16rwhp is pretty pricey if you ask me.
This is true, but you can't always just look at a dyno HP number when assessing the value of a particular mod. Running your engine with extreme ACT's may not cost you a lot of HP but it will put the motor on the edge of detonation all the time which is not a positive thing regarding headgaskets and the like.

Getting a great dyno number is much easier than having consistent and reliable HP.
 
kenewagner said:
Get one with a shroud for you fan. Check out the Dbl ICs out there. Some have better features than others

Ken

There are 2 big problems with double IC's. One is that they are notorious for leaks. If the unit isn't pressure tested, don't buy it.

The other problem is airflow. The double IC won't want to flow ANY air through it so you have to help it out. I recommend a shorter AC condensor to unblock the airflow and a fan. Fans on both sides are even better.
 
Well, instead of just staring at how much peak HP you gained what happened to your guy's average HP? That's what you're supposed to look at.

Just like what Kurt said about his gains with the methanol kit. He gained around 5 peak rwhp, but at other RPM's he gained near 20rwhp. I may be off, but I was just going from memory.

Not to mention with the FMIC you get to keep a cooler intake charge for longer periods of time. My intercooler never heat soaks. I'm sure a FMIC ensures a better ET at the same power level of a DIC.
 
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Blah blah blah... I'm sorry guys, but your replies are starting to sound more like a recorded sales pitch than anything else. To me, the MP FMIC product is no different than the MPIII. It's being sold based soley on it's brand reputation instead of overall effectiveness.

This is what I imagine Charles was thinking when he designed it -

"Let's see... where will this mod be the least effective?? I know!! Let's put the IC between the condenser and the radiator! That way both the A/C AND the radiator work less effectively! Then I'll charge forty bagillion dollars for it, and these idiots will still buy it because it's got the MP label on it! BRILLIANT!!!"

Now excuse me, I have to put on my flame suit.

PS: I still prefer a good front mount over a double IC. The stock cores are pretty much crap. Using two of them isn't suddenly going to make them any better.
 
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Dbl Ic

You can run a 180 degree thermostat with the fans set to come on at a cooler temp. The Dbl IC is a good alternative to the FMIC. I built my FMIC but I have no AC to worry about and I have a Griffen radiator

Ken
 
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Pablo94SC said:
Blah blah blah... I'm sorry guys, but your replies are starting to sound more like a recorded sales pitch than anything else. To me, the MP FMIC product is no different than the MPIII. It's being sold based soley on it's brand reputation instead of overall effectiveness.

This is what I imagine Charles was thinking when he designed it -

"Let's see... where will this mod be the least effective?? I know!! Let's put the IC between the condenser and the radiator! That way both the A/C AND the radiator work less effectively! Then I'll charge forty bagillion dollars for it, and these idiots will still buy it because it's got the MP label on it! BRILLIANT!!!"

Now excuse me, I have to put on my flame suit.

PS: I still prefer a good front mount over a double IC. The stock cores are pretty much crap. Using two of them isn't suddenly going to make them any better.

And my reply to you is "Blah, Blah, Blah!" We know you hate the MP fmic

I still say for the apparent ease of installation, packaging (fitting under a stock hood, looks, etc.) the MP fmic is a decent deal. Sure you could prbably build a fmic for cheaper, but would it be as easy to install, work with existing parts(you don't have to replace the AC condenser to route the tubes), look as nice and be able to fit under the stock hood? I think it would be difficult to do. Sure it's not the optimum location, especially if you want to run the AC when its 90° outside, but for building a fmic option around the existing engine components, I think MP did a good job.
 
CMac89 said:
Well, instead of just staring at how much peak HP you gained what happened to your guy's average HP? That's what you're supposed to look at.

Just like what Kurt said about his gains with the methanol kit. He gained around 5 peak rwhp, but at other RPM's he gained near 20rwhp. I may be off, but I was just going from memory.

Not to mention with the FMIC you get to keep a cooler intake charge for longer periods of time. My intercooler never heat soaks. I'm sure a FMIC ensures a better ET at the same power level of a DIC.

I went back and looked up the post from 2002 where I reported the dyno numbers after installing the MP FMIC.

http://www.sccoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14152&highlight=FMIC+dyno+results

I actually gained 21.3 rwhp and 15.3 rwtq and not 16 rwhp as mentioned earlier. I imagine results will vary car to car based on how bad you needed a larger intercooler.

David
 
No matter where you put a front mount you will be giving...to get...

You will get higher engine temps regardless of where you position the IC core.....Now higher ACT does indeed lead to detonation....But so does higher water temps..and oil temps..A hot engine leads to hot spots which lead to detonation.....

If you like AC.....If the IC core is put in front of your condensor just forget about it....If it is sandwiched inbetween that and the rad you will still get a less efficient AC system due to less airflow but at least you will get something..Of course the IC efficiency will suffer slightly...So in reality the MP front mount is nothing more then a compramise....Not a bad design so to speak. You give to get.

SO whats more important to you.....A cool running car?...Lower ACT?....AC????

These are all things to consider.

You see I like my stock located Spearco replacement IC with a fan and shorter condensor..Seems like the ideal place for your IC..But Spearco stopped producing....I'm sure the stock ic tubes are semi restrictive in thier present form as well....

WHat I'd like to see is a stock located IC as big as potentially possible using a good core...2 1/2 inch inlets and outlets, a shorter condensor,some sort of airdam to direct the airflow...And a fan...

My AC would work great,,,Car wouldnt get any hotter....ACT temps would be lower...And would perform better then my Spearco..

Kind of like what Wynn did on his car....Except using a REAL core

Thats what I would do if I were a fabricator..Seems like a win win to me
 
I agree Damon, but like you said a shorter AC condenser would be required. And like you, I'm happy with my Spearco IC and I know a shorter AC condenser would help with cooling my air charge.
 
You might look into the Snow menthol injection kit. Priced at a fraction of the MP front mount. It would lower you air temps as well as increasing you octane.
Kind of a liquid Intercooler. There will always be a lot of opinions out there about whats best. A lot of guys love their Dbl ICs but they still have the lower IC tube running by the exhaust manifold, not a good thing. Price a DBL IC and the snow kit will be still a lot less than a FMIC. Get a good tune so you can bump up the timing, that would be a nice option instead of the FMIC. As for the stock cores being junk. A lot of people hold that opinion but I built, due to lack of money at the time, my FMIC out of two stock IC cores side by side and fabricated new end tanks for it. If you think the stock cores dont do a good job just ask Dave Dalke what the ACT temps on my car ran each time he tuned it. Regardless Damon is right, decide whats important, make a descision and implement it. Nobody has a lock on whats the perfect setup for you or your car

Ken
 
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