94 SC Leaking Transmission Pan

tedallen

Registered User
Hi,

I just replaced the filter/screen and gasket with a Ford gasket that is supposed to be reusable (fairly stiff rubber with a couple of ribs that run the entire perimeter of the gasket near both the inner and outer edges).

I cleaned both mating surfaces (there wasn't much on either as the old gasket was the same material and supposedly doesn't require any type of sealant) and initially tightened all 14 bolts finger tight.

I then torqued them in an alternating pattern to the specified torque setting in my Haynes manual of a maximum of 120 inch pounds.

The pan is leaking. Can anyone tell me if this is the correct torque setting or if there are any bulletins indicating that a sealant should indeed be used?

If the torque setting needs to be higher will I need to drop the pan and clean the fluid off of the mating surfaces before retorquing or will the fluid trapped between the ribs either be trapped or eventually work its way out either internally or externally?

Thanks in advance for any assistance.
 
94 SC Tran Pan Still Leaking

Since the original post I have spoken with a local Ford mechanic. He stated that they don't use a torque wrench, they just tighten the transmission bolts with the reusable gasket good and snug.

When I asked for his estimate of "good and snug" in inch/lbs he said maybe 180 in/lb. I torqued the bolts in graduations to 144, 168, and then 180 in/lbs. It still leaked, although not as bad.

I then decided to try torquing in graduations until I felt like it was about as tight as I could go with the small torque wrench. I stopped at around 300 in/lb and it still leaks.

Does anyone have any ideas? I am getting ready to go out and try tightening them with a 1/2 drive ratchet as tight as I can, but am fearful of breaking a bolt or stripping the holes in the transmission.

The reason I got into this mess was because it had started to leak so I decided to change the filter and gasket. Any possibility the pan could have warped without being hit or anyone trying to overtighten it?

Best Regards,

Ted Allen
 
Its possible the pan could be warped .. or the gasket could have a leak. Ive never torqued my pan bolts down, just tightened it up and it was good. If possible you might want to replace the gasket, or take the pan off and check for flatness ... ( might be a good time to upgrade to the 96/97 style Filter and Pan and accumulator pistons if you havent done so .. )

- Dan
 
The lip of the pan might be deformed around the bolt holes because the bolts were overtightened. When you take the pan off, place a narrow piece of wood under the lip and tap on the holes with a hammer to straighten the lip, which will ensure that the mating surface with the gasket is flat.
 
Thanks Ddubb and J.D. for your replies.

Ddubb: Where would be a good source for the 96/97 pan/filter and accumulator pistons? Can the pistons be replaced with only the pan removed?

I have owned the vehicle since it was new and I know that the pan has not been removed since Ford did warranty work on the transmission at approximately 10 years ago. The transmission has been flushed, but no pan removal.

It developed a leak which got worse over time. I decided to replace the filter/screen and gasket, assuming that the old gasket had become brittle.

I did not know it was a reusable gasket, so I bought a new one from Ford and installed it. I am quite certain I did not initially overtighten the pan, as I only went the Haynes manual recommended max of 120 in/lbs and it leaked like crazy.

Is it possible the pan could have warped with age due to heat? The transmission fluid is blowing onto the exhaust pipes and has built up black soot on them. I have noticed the exhaust getting louder and wonder if it could have gotten so hot burning on the pipes that it is making hole(s) in them?

Best Regards,

Ted Allen
 
Why not upgrade while you're down there?

SCP Finned Aluminum 4R70W Deep Transmission Pan $125.00

Can't ask for much more, and your tranny will thank you...cooling, extra fluid...

You'll need the deep filter too though
 
Thanks for the info Tech Greek. Ddubb had mentioned the same thing I believe along with the accumulator pistons.

Do you know a source for the pan, filter, and accumulator pistons?

Can the accumulator pistons be changed with only the pan/filter removed?

Do you know if the same reusable gasket works with both the stock 94 pan and the 96/97 pan?

Thanks to all for your assistance. I just finished attempting to tighten again and it still appears that I have a leak, so I'll definitely be pulling the pan again.

Best Regards,

Ted Allen
 
Ted, Once I thought my pan was leaking and my tails shaft gasket was leaking and dripping on the pan. If the pan is leaking for sure I got one up here in Salisbury for I think around 40 to 50 dollars at the ford dealer. That was the deeper late model pan and the trans shop around the corner from the Ford dealer sells the good gaskets for 10 to 15 dollars. I think I may have a gasket that is good. If you need help or a second opinion I am right up the road I also have another pan I think if you want to try that. If you do need anything I am off of work all week:D just let me know.
 
Thanks for the info Tech Greek. Ddubb had mentioned the same thing I believe along with the accumulator pistons.

Do you know a source for the pan, filter, and accumulator pistons?

Can the accumulator pistons be changed with only the pan/filter removed?

Do you know if the same reusable gasket works with both the stock 94 pan and the 96/97 pan?

Thanks to all for your assistance. I just finished attempting to tighten again and it still appears that I have a leak, so I'll definitely be pulling the pan again.

Best Regards,

Ted Allen

I'm ordering everything on my car from Super Coupe Performance, not only because they have the BEST customer serivce ever, but because they are solely for our cars, and I feel that the money's better spent there than at some joe smchoe dealership.

The deep pan from SCP is custom, not a later year afaik.

As far as the internals, again, SCP has everything, www.supercoupeperformance.com
 
Heres a link to Jerry's article on modifying the 4r70w transmission, it covers pretty much everything you would want to upgrade ..

http://www.tccoa.com/articles/tranny/transmission/index.shtml

I believe you will only be able to replace the 1-2 Accumulator without removing the Valve Body. There is a Snap ring holding it in place, and the 96+ Accumulator is steel stamped with a rubber seal - the one you have is aluminum and prone to wearing the bore causing leaks or a delayed 1-2 shift. If you wanted to replace this, you should get the 1-2 Accumulator cover also. The 2-3 accumulator should also be replaced but unless youre dropping the valve body, I wouldnt worry about it.

The gasket is the same for the 94/95 as the 96/97, so yours will work as long as it isnt damaged or causing the leaks ..

If you are dropping your pan, you should definately get the 96+ Transmission Pan and Filter - they hold 1.5 extra quarts of ATF ( which you should be using Mercon V fluid only ) , it doesnt cost more than $30 for the pan, and the Filter is around $20 or so. You dont need the aftermarket Pan with the fins for $125, especially if you arent doing any modifications to the transmission itself. You should however, get a Transmission Cooler which will help your transmission last longer by keeping the temperatures down.

I get all of my parts from Jason, hes the official Ford parts source at TCCOA.com .. he is located in NC also .. you will get a discount for your Thunderbird parts, great guy to work with.

Jason Preslar
Harrelson Ford
6700 South Blvd.
Charlotte N.C. 28210

Toll Free 1-800-992-3938

Local (704) 552-2848

- Dan
 
Does anyone happen to have a diagram and/or photos demonstrating the location of the 1-2 Accumulator and/or 1-2 accumulator cover inside the 94 SC 4R70W transmission? If not, a point of reference relative to the filter mounting hole, font/rear of pan, etc. would be much appreciated.

Since I am going to attempt to replace the 1-2 accumulator cover with the revised cover, I don't know how similar it will look to the older cover for comparison.

According to Ddubb I should be able to replace these components with just the pan and filter removed.

Best Regards,

Ted Allen
 
Heres the link for the shift kit installation ..

http://www.tccoa.com/articles/tranny/index.html

The first one is Jerry's transmission thesis. The second is A-train's shift kit install. Towards the bottom there is a diagram showing where all of the pistons are located. The 1-2 is located near the bellhousing area, opposite of the dipstick.
You will see a snap ring holding in the 1-2 cover, and after that is removed, you can take out the cover, bottom spring, 1-2 accumulator and top spring.

- Dan
 
Thanks for the link Ddubb. When reviewing A-Train's document I was wondering if you could confirm something for me?

When removing and replacing the 1-2 Accumulator with the upgrade piston and cover, he mentions removing the original spring and replacing it with blue return spring F75Z-7F284-AA.

However, if I read his comments correctly, he says to install the new return spring in the bore above the 1-2 accumulator piston as opposed to below it between the accumulator piston and the accumulator cover. Can you confirm?

If so, what ensures that the spring doesn't shift to one side or the other in the bore above the piston and rub against the walls of the bore as it expands and contracts?

Best Regards,

Ted Allen
 
Even my Lentech cast aluminum pan leaks unless I use RTV sealer on both sides of the gasket and really tighten the bolts up.

David
 
Aluminum pans are a pita to get them not to leak. Silicone is required.

If you follow Jerry's article you will quickly learn that the 94/95 transmission is not a very good core. I prefer to get a 03 v6 mustang core and build using both transmissions.
Alan
 
Hi David and DirtyD0g,

Thanks for the responses. Can either one of you comment on whether or not A-Train's article regarding installation of Jerry's Shift Improver Kit actually intends for the replacement spring for the 1-2 accumulator piston to be installed on top of the piston as opposed to below it in between the piston and the cover?

Also, is there a particular sealant you would recommend to use with the "reusable" gasket? Is the gasket still reusable if sealant is used (i.e. can it be cleaned up without damaging it)?

Best Regards,

Ted Allen
 
A-train's article is intended for if you are modifying the seperator plate ( shift kit ) .. and in that case, you leave out the bottom spring for a firmer shift, and a firmer spring is used for the top. Normally, there is a spring on top and bottom of the 1-2 accumulator, and there is an updated 1-2 accumulator cover as well that is not mentioned in the article or parts list - it is however listed in Jerry's thesis. The bore keeps the spring in place, and there is a pocket on the top of the 1-2 accumulator that holds the spring in place, so its not going anywhere. Sometimes if you have a firm 1-2 shift or chirp the tires, and later pull the 1-2 accumulator out, you might find a broken spring.

So unless you plan on modifying the valve body, and you just want a stock shift, you can keep the stock springs ( if they are not broken ) on top and bottom of the 1-2 accumulator, and just replace the accumulator piston and cover with the updated pieces.

Hope that helps

- Dan
 
Hi Dan,

Thanks for the update. The schematic I have doesn't show both a top and bottom spring used with the 1-2 accumulator. It only shows the bottom spring. I just spoke with a Ford transmission mechanic at a local dealership and he made it sound like you would get rid of the original spring on the bottom (as shown in the schematic in A-Train's article) and replace it with the blue spring but put it on top of the accumulator piston instead of between the piston and accumulator cover.

He said he typically leaves the spring in when replacing the 2-3 accumulator, but that it would just provide a firmer shift if it was left out. I have decided to attempt to go ahead and drop the valve body and replace the 2-3 accumulator as well (sounds like it is just a few electrical connections and 25 more bolts. The mechanic did say it was important to torque the valve body bolts to 85 in/lb. My torque wrench only goes down to 120 in/lb.

He also stated that he has rarely ever seen the pan leaking with the reusable gasket and that 120 in/lb with no sealant should be sufficient. He says almost every time a transmission leak for the 4R70W transmission comes to him it is the paper gasket between the main housing and extension housing that has gone bad and/or the extension housing bolts have worked loose.

He said the easiest way to replace this gasket is to drop the rear differential to allow clearance for the driveshaft to slide back over top of it just enough to remove the extension housing after dropping the transmission crossmember and removing the transmission mount. He said if you haven't done it before you should expect a full day job. He said the Ford shop manual actually calls for dropping the gas tank instead, but that it is more work.

I suppose that gasket may have been at least part of my original leak, but I know for certain that the pan is leaking now.

The mechanic was quite helpful and even gave me the updated extension housing gasket and two different extension housing rear seals so that I would have the correct one to replace while I have the driveshaft loose.

Best Regards,

Ted
 
Befor you rip into this project check one last thing, The O ring on the dip stick tube right whare it goes into the trans.
After 10 birds you get to know there droppings;)
 
I am finally getting back to this project after getting side tracked with other auto issues.

I obtained the following components to upgrade my 4R70W transmission:

Later model pan with dimple (6L3Z-7A194-A)
Filter to match with new pan (F6AZ-7A098-A)
New pan gasket (F2VY-7A191-A)
New 1-2 Accumulator (F7AZ-7F251-AA)
New 1-2 Accumulator Cover (F4AZ-7F247-A)
New 1-2 Accumulator Spring - Blue Spring (F75Z-7F284-AA)
New 2-3 Accumulator (F7AZ-7H292-AB)

I just want to confirm a couple of things. Jerry's article indicates part number F7AZ-7H292-AA for the 2-3 Accumulator. I gave that part number to Ford and the supplied me with the BA part. Is this going to be an issue?

Also, if I read correctly, Jerry's article indicates installing the Blue spring (F75Z-7F284-AA) above the 1-2 Accumulator for mild HP implementations along with a bottom spring (F7AZ-7F284-BA). He then changes to top spring (F75Z-7F284-BA) with not bottom spring for HP implementations of 300 and above.

My vehicle is pretty much stock. as such my HP is below 300. Will I be OK going with the F75Z-7F284-AA (blue spring) in the top of the 1-2 accumulator with no bottom spring since I am running lower HP than where Jerry called for omitting the bottom spring or do I need to install the bottom spring (F7AZ-7F284-BA) as well? I believe A-Train's article says to omit the bottom spring without reference to horsepower differences. Ddubb clarified that this was only necessary if the separator plate is being modified. Since I am not doing so will I still be OK if I go with the new "blue spring" on top and no bottom spring?

Also, both Jerry and A-Train's articles specify installing the new 2-3 Accumulator and retainer without any spring at all (remove the stock spring with no replacement). I would like to confirm this as well.

I also have a new gasket and seal for the extension housing, but am going to tackle that at a later date. I need to get the car back on the road for now.

Best Regards,

Ted
 
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