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SCrazy
09-04-2007, 03:27 PM
I'm looking to buy a set of tires for a pair of the aluminum spare wheels. The right size seems to be 165/15 and I see a number of posts where people have bought them for like $40.00. The only tires in that size range I can seem to find are Mickey Thompson or simlar for $120.00. Anybody bought these things lately and where???

Thanks

XR7 Dave
09-04-2007, 03:33 PM
I'm looking to buy a set of tires for a pair of the aluminum spare wheels. The right size seems to be 165/15 and I see a number of posts where people have bought them for like $40.00. The only tires in that size range I can seem to find are Mickey Thompson or simlar for $120.00. Anybody bought these things lately and where???

Thanks

Since the purpose of skinnies is to lose weight then you really should get the expensive ones. If you want cheap you can get 165/15's just about anywhere for $40 each but they are radials and therefore much heavier (and also street legal).

SCrazy
09-04-2007, 03:36 PM
I was also worried about the expensive skinnys being only 4-ply with the weight of our cars. Are you aware of anything being available in 8-ply or have people been running the 4-ply with no issues?

Not trying to cheap out but I want to stay safe.

XR7 Dave
09-04-2007, 03:40 PM
I was also worried about the expensive skinnys being only 4-ply with the weight of our cars. Are you aware of anything being available in 8-ply or have people been running the 4-ply with no issues?

Not trying to cheap out but I want to stay safe.

For dragstrip use the race tires will be fine.

SCrazy
09-04-2007, 04:03 PM
Some quick research yeilded the following food for thought.

El Cheapo Volkwagen 165/15 Radial Tire 17# $45.00(Unavailable at Tire Rack)
MT Sportsman Front 26x15 8-ply Tire 19# $110.00 (Jegs)
MT ET Drag Front 26x15 4-ply Tire 12# $130.00 (Jegs)

There is no way the 8-ply MT tires make any sense lots of $ and way to heavy. So the question is......Is 10# of rotating mass worth $200.00??

David Neibert
09-04-2007, 04:40 PM
So the question is......Is 10# of rotating mass worth $200.00??

Not to me....that's why I'm using the VW tires mounted on steel spare rims.

David

Ira R.
09-04-2007, 04:42 PM
Brian, look into the Morosa D/S 2's. On the wheel I think they weighed in at about 23 lbs. They are also supposed to have a wider profile under braking to slightly increase stopping efficiency. No idea how true that may or may not be. Summitt lists them for $120 also.

Ira

T1Bird
09-04-2007, 05:31 PM
Brian they say for every 10 pounds of unsprung weight reduced its a tenth in the 1/4 mile
Ive been running the VW tires now for 3 years on the spares, no issues at all, not as fast as you trapping 104-106mph but I think these will hold up just fine for you.

Ira R.
09-04-2007, 06:22 PM
Brian they say for every 10 pounds of unsprung weight reduced its a tenth in the 1/4 mile
Ive been running the VW tires now for 3 years on the spares, no issues at all, not as fast as you trapping 104-106mph but I think these will hold up just fine for you.

I don't know man. Saving 20 lbs could put you in the 11's :D

Ira

racecougar
09-04-2007, 06:33 PM
Not to me....that's why I'm using the VW tires mounted on steel spare rims.

Me either. I'm running the cheap 165R15's on a pair of aluminum spares. They weigh in at 27.5 lbs each (mounted on the wheels).

-Rod

David Neibert
09-04-2007, 07:18 PM
I don't know man. Saving 20 lbs could put you in the 11's :D

Ira

He's only going to save 5# on each tire...10# total. A 10# reduction isn't even going to show up on the timeslip.

David

David Neibert
09-04-2007, 07:21 PM
Brian they say for every 10 pounds of unsprung weight reduced its a tenth in the 1/4 mile
Ive been running the VW tires now for 3 years on the spares, no issues at all, not as fast as you trapping 104-106mph but I think these will hold up just fine for you.

I think that it's closer to a 1/10 for every 100# or 10 HP.

David

CMac89
09-04-2007, 07:32 PM
Some useful information I must share with you guys.

One pound of rotating weight is worth ten pounds of static. 100lbs. of static weight is worth a tenth and 10lbs. of rotating weight is worth a tenth.

This applies to a nine second car meaning that it's even more beneficial for a slower car. It could be 50lbs per tenth and 5lbs. of rotating weight on a 12 or 13 second car.

THE BIRDMAN
09-04-2007, 07:34 PM
I think that it's closer to a 1/10 for every 100# or 10 HP.

David


I'm pretty sure I read the same thing.I beleive it's 100#'s of weight reduces you et by a tenth.But I also read where if you lose either 10 or 20 pounds of rotational/unsprung weight (i.e wheels,tires,brake rotors)you'll also lower it by a tenth.So I think you're both right.


Jay

THE BIRDMAN
09-04-2007, 07:35 PM
Some useful information I must share with you guys.

One pound of rotating weight is worth ten pounds of static. 100lbs. of static weight is worth a tenth and 10lbs. of rotating weight is worth a tenth.

This applies to a nine second car meaning that it's even more beneficial for a slower car. It could be 50lbs per tenth and 5lbs. of rotating weight on a 12 or 13 second car.



See that's what I thought ya snuck in their while I was typing LOL.


Jay

T1Bird
09-04-2007, 07:36 PM
They say its 150 pounds for a tenth in the 1/4 of raw weight, then a tenth in the 1/4 for every 10 pounds taken OFF (unsprung weight) something that rotates, when something with mass rotates beyond a certain RPM, it gains 4x its intial weight, ex, a pulley weighing 10 pounds upon spun at 5000rpm is said to actually weigh 42.3 pounds.

This is not a raw weight that if it were possible to lift it at that rpm it would weigh that much, but a weight of negative insertia on its method of being spung. This is how Ive gone about everything on my car and it seems to be working.

Of course all this only comes into play to certain hp and certain 1/4 mile times, as they say its alot harder for a car running 8.80s to go 8.78 then it is for a car to go from 14.00 to 12.00

Sorry just saw others posted while I was posting this, my bad

Ira R.
09-04-2007, 07:39 PM
So what does 40lbs out of the front seat equate to?? And can it be considered rolling weight? :D

Ira

T1Bird
09-04-2007, 07:44 PM
Ira, 40 pounds out of a seat is raw weight, if your talking your passenger seat, if its a power with compresser SC seat, its 68.3 to 75 pounds, depending on year of the seat.

Weight is a huge issue to me, its how Ive got my stock head/cam car going [email protected] :D, I have removed all the AC, fiberglass hood, passenger and complete rear seat out when I race, package tray out of trunk, then anything that Rotates I have gone to aluminum minus the driveshaft, thats my next task.

I just look at it, your running times to not run a passenger, so why race with the seat, just take it out at the track and put it back in when your done.

CMac89
09-04-2007, 07:54 PM
To change classes I have to swap around on total car weight. So the numbers I have given are quite accurate.

This is why I think that just taking a passenger seat out and the rear seat are worth atleast a tenth in the SC.

David Neibert
09-04-2007, 07:55 PM
They say its 150 pounds for a tenth in the 1/4 of raw weight, then a tenth in the 1/4 for every 10 pounds taken OFF (unsprung weight) something that rotates, when something with mass rotates beyond a certain RPM, it gains 4x its intial weight, ex, a pulley weighing 10 pounds upon spun at 5000rpm is said to actually weigh 42.3 pounds.

This is not a raw weight that if it were possible to lift it at that rpm it would weigh that much, but a weight of negative insertia on its method of behing spung. This is how Ive gone about everything on my car and it seems to be working.

Of course all this only comes into play to certain hp and certain 1/4 mile times, as they say its alot harder for a car running 8.80s to go 8.78 then it is for a car to go from 14.00 to 12.00

Sorry just saw others posted while I was posting this, my bad


Hummm...maybe I should find me some of those aluminum spares.

David

Ira R.
09-04-2007, 08:28 PM
Ira, 40 pounds out of a seat is raw weight, if your talking your passenger seat, if its a power with compresser SC seat, its 68.3 to 75 pounds, depending on year of the seat.

Weight is a huge issue to me, its how Ive got my stock head/cam car going [email protected] :D, I have removed all the AC, fiberglass hood, passenger and complete rear seat out when I race, package tray out of trunk, then anything that Rotates I have gone to aluminum minus the driveshaft, thats my next task.

I just look at it, your running times to not run a passenger, so why race with the seat, just take it out at the track and put it back in when your done.

Thanks for the feedback, but I am not talking about 40 lbs out of the passenger seat ;) The lady who occupies it weighs slightly more than that :eek: No, one of my winter mods was removing 40 lbs from behind the wheel! :p

I don't work to pull weight out of the car. Oh sure, I empty the trunk and I have a set of lightweight rims, but I run it fully streetable, air conditioning and all. I'm not building a race car, although I will admit to trying very hard to go as fast as I possibly can. But I don't just own the car(s) to set spectacular et's. Don't get me wrong here, this car will be one of the best out there if I have any say in it, but I'm not building it just for that. Streetable stealth more likely.

I run these cars because I have always loved the look and feel of the car, going back to my first one in 1990. Do I want to go faster? You bet. Are there guys out there setting records that I want to catch or show off to? You can bet on that too! But pulling weight just to do that is one thing I probably will never do. There are other ways to have a stock long block and run 13.0.

Sorry, I do tend to ramble on.........

Ira

T1Bird
09-04-2007, 08:37 PM
Ira, congrats on the 40 pound acheivment, thats really good, hope thats made things better.


Dave or Brian, you guys really want to see your AR cars put down some numbers, do a dyno run, then bolt on the alum skinnies to the rear and do a dyno run on those :D:D

David Neibert
09-04-2007, 11:43 PM
Dave or Brian, you guys really want to see your AR cars put down some numbers, do a dyno run, then bolt on the alum skinnies to the rear and do a dyno run on those


Would probably be a great smoke show.

David

SCrazy
09-05-2007, 08:17 AM
Would probably be a great smoke show.

David

I've got a smoke show planned for my flat spotted street tires, I think I'll keep the skinnys on the front though.

Thanks for the good discussion guys sounds like I'm going to drain the stash by a couple hundred bucks........

Micahdogg
09-05-2007, 11:18 AM
Brian, the only reason I have 165R's is because they are safer on the street. But my 15 X 3 skinnies up front are just 6 lbs lighter than my 15 X 8's in back with 26 X 11.5's!!!! So if you can afford it, I would go with a true front runner.

mannysc
09-05-2007, 12:01 PM
I have a friend who says he may be willing to make some 15x3 wheels for our sc's he makes wheels for motor cycles and can cnc them to look like sc wheels. also looking at 15's for rearto take advantage of sidewall flex.

and cheaper tire combos just have to clear the darn brakes

Ira R.
09-05-2007, 12:04 PM
I have a friend who says he may be willing to make some 15x3 wheels for our sc's he makes wheels for motor cycles and can cnc them to look like sc wheels. also looking at 15's for rearto take advantage of sidewall flex.

and cheaper tire combos just have to clear the darn brakes

Wonder if he would also be willing to make a light weight replacement for the stock 16" wheels?? It could even look exactly like the stock one, just weigh a whole lot less.

Ira

1MTNCAT
09-05-2007, 02:50 PM
The old adage was 1/10th per every hundred pounds taken out of the car. I've found on these boats that it seems like 60lbs in most cases are worth about a 1/10th then again that may be dependant on the total weight/power ratio to begin with.

Like Ira, I've always prided myself on running with a full interior, full weight car and have never removed the seats or for that matter even considered it. Other than pulling the spare and jack out of the back and the miscellaneous things I carry in the trunk, I run it like it is. The exception to that is the drag tires.

BTW my front drag tires on the aluminum spares weigh in at 25 lbs each. That being said they are also 28" goodyear skinnies up front, not 26". 28" drag slicks on the rear also on stock TBIRD rims. Removing the street rims and tires (208 lbs for all 4) drops to (122 lbs for all 4). Thats roughly 78 lbs and 78 lbs of Rotational weight mind you. A good test if anyone wants to do it sometime with similiar conditions, weigh and run on your street tires, then turnaround and run on the Drag tires/skinnies. You'll get the point. Two things should happen, (1) car will 60 ft much better off the line, (2) It will pull much harder up top due to not having to turn all that additional/rotational weight.

Make no mistake, I was thrilled when mine went 12.5's-12.7 @ 110.+ MPH couple weeks ago with the DA at 3500 ft on the street tires with a 1.97 60 ft. Hopefully soon I'll get to see what it'll do on the drag tires.

Hope this is useful to some!!:)