Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 17

Thread: rant - a question about my ethics

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Tejas...home of Stevie Ray Vaughan
    Posts
    1,748

    rant - a question about my ethics

    This has developed on the Classifieds board, I moved it here because there's some double-talk goin' on that needs to be straightened out.
    It started with my spotting some pics on someone's website that were snatched from my model car page. I called him on it and some progress has been made on removing my pics from his webpage.

    Next thing ya know, the peanut gallery shows up. I took some parts to Houston & got them powder coated and a few weeks later decided to try the process myself. I made the financial investment not only in equipment but in long distance phone calls. I also scoured the www for info and researched the subject until I was blue in the face (and then some). As a result, the powder coater in Houston throws a fit. Here's the results as they are so far.

    (feel free to join in)

    Originally posted by PegasusPowder on the SCCoA Classifieds bbs
    tbird88,

    You should be ashamed of yourself. Here you are going off on this guy for using your pictures (possibly true), but while you are writing about copyright violation, no less than two weeks ago you conducted a form of "industrial espionage" against me!

    reality check below


    When you told me you were down on your luck, I agreed to powder coat several hundred dollars worth of parts from your Thunderbird "Elvira". [/size]

    Down on my luck? Several hundreds of dollars worth of what? Oh, you mean the top, return plenum & the alternator case. Oops, forgot to mention the pulley! So much for the 100's of $'s...

    By the way, don't forget to mention me tryin' to get you to take something if anything after my 2nd trip over there. I just about had to pull a gun to make you even take the $20 for beer.

    OOOOOOHHHHH...How convenient that you forget to mention that I gave you phone #'s and names so you could score FREE samples of powder right there in your own city, the value that you yourself quoted as being worth $200-300 and up.

    You're welcome.



    This was done with the full understanding between us that you would advertise the services of Pegasus Powder Coating to the Ford Thunderbird community, and make a commision to boot.

    Your brother might have offered to advertise for you, I never said one word about promoting your company on any bbs. Your brother also bragged about you on the bbs, he was proud & rightfully so, but I don't know if he followed through on promoting your services. Also, you have your own website, you are more than able to advertise it on any bbs.

    ALSO...there is somebody sittin' right here that witnessed you sayin' that I should advertise it as my own work but I promptly told you that there was no way that I would do that. I never have and never will advertise someone else's work as mine.

    They also sat there and listened to how you could care less if anyone wanted you to do powder coating. Why? Because as you explained it you set up the system purely for powder coating your race car. That's the only reason (in your words) that you bought the equipment in the first place.

    Last but not least, YOU'RE IN HOUSTON, TEXAS. You ought to be drowning in money from powder coating but like you said, you just do it as a "hobby" because you have no interest in doing it full time.



    Instead, you came by, used my consumables, my time, and my powder coating knowledge in order to go and start your own powder coating shop. Upon reflection, I wonder if, on the way over, you were formulating a plan to take advantage of my generousity.

    Um, yeah, I drove the 75-80 miles to your house & picked up a bag of sand for your blaster (ok, I know it ain't much) and did just about everything except lay the powder on (stripping, cleaning, more stripping, more cleaning).
    Consumables...How many times did ya stand there & laugh about how little the powder cost?
    Time...We won't go into what you said you'd be doin' instead if I hadn't driven over.
    Knowledge...I guess you invented this process. You have no idea of the hours I've spent on the 'net and $ on long distance learning on my own long before I ever visited you and even more since. Try goin' to Google & punching in POWDER & COAT, hope you have a few weeks to look through it all.



    I have chosen, because of your actions, to have absolutely no contact with my brother, who recommended you as an honest and upstanding person.

    Sounds like an excuse. First time I came over, you wanted to talk about problems between your brother & you. Like I told you in person, the problems you have with your brother need to be dealt with by you.


    I wonder if you will enjoy driving Elvira around knowing that several of the parts on her were obtained by ill-gotten means. Speaking for myself, I certainly would not. Of the parts powder coating by Pegasus Powder Coating, please do not try and pass them off as your own.

    Um...Nobody has ever said otherwise (or will). The top that is on my car was indeed powder coated by you. The other parts have been stripped for re-coating because of dust etc (no offence intended). I'll strip the top too. Can't say I'll do any better but I'm gonna try.


    I wish you continued success with your business and hope that any future professional relationships you forge are based on mutual trust and respect.

    Thanks. Next time we talk on the phone (remember that Sunday morning?) and you don't have a single negative thing to say about me trying to do powder coating on my own (instead of drivin' back & forth to Houston), please don't turn around and type up some email or make a post on a bbs acting the exact opposite. I still don't have a clue why you give me your blessing one moment on the phone and then the next it's Katy-bar-the-door. Care to explain?

    This little episode wreaks of the idea that I'm stealing bread out of the mouth of babes. Nope, I live too far from you to constantly drive back & forth. It's that simple. It would seem that if a guy down my street wants his Honda valve cover powder coated that you want exclusive rights. Sorry man, I don't think so.
    Again, per our phone conversation a few weeks ago (that Sunday mornin') everything was hunky-dory and rightfully so. Where you come off with all of this I have no clue.


    'bird

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    5
    Tbird88,

    Your comments have been read and understood. I do not necessarily agree with them but that it my right.

    A person can change their appearance on a moment-by-moment basis, but character is forever. Your future dealings with those around you will bear witness to my original comments so I do not feel the need to expound on them.

    Again, I wish you continued success in whatever endevour you wish to engage in.

    Regards
    PegasusPowder

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Tejas...home of Stevie Ray Vaughan
    Posts
    1,748
    Originally posted by PegasusPowder
    [B]Tbird88,

    Your comments have been read and understood. I do not necessarily agree with them but that it my right.

    A person can change their appearance on a moment-by-moment basis, but character is forever. Your future dealings with those around you will bear witness to my original comments so I do not feel the need to expound on them.

    Again, I wish you continued success in whatever endevour you wish to engage in.

    Regards
    PegasusPowder


    Sorry to be so abrupt but the facts speak for themselves, I quoted what you said on the phone & in person. After the trash you posted in the Classifieds and in your email, I don't really care at this point whether you "agree" or not. You came on these boards accusing me of "ripping you off" and taking childish shots at my character. I stand behind every word I've said here.

    My "character"?...You won't find me telling someone one thing on the phone Sunday morning and then telling them the exact opposite in an email on Sunday night. Hopefully the next person that you tell "go for it" will be ready for the about-face you do when they try it on their own.

    Took the words right outa my mouth:
    "A person can change their appearance on a moment-by-moment basis"

    'bird

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    5
    Wynn,

    The quote "A person can change their appearance on a moment-by-moment basis, but character is forever." was in the third person. Quoted from Robert Serling's "The Electra Story".

    Again, I have no problem with you at all. It is through my own trust that I showed you how I performed my powder coating. Had I known, in advance, that you were looking to duplicate my business model then certainly you can understand what my position on that would have been.

    Insofar as my relationship with my brother is concerned, I will explain it to you as I explained it to him. "I am judged by the people, and the ethics of those people, that I associate with. You recommended I associate with this person and, given the breach of trust that has occured, I hold you responsible". It was then that I bid him and his a happy farewell.

    I implore you to understand that I mean you no disrespect or ill will, on the contrary, I wish you and yours the very best of luck in whatever you wish to do. Me, and my business, are very well respected in the groups that I perform work for. I can not, under any circumstances, allow that reputation to be dulled by any association that those groups may find "questionable".

    This is the last I have to say about this matter, and am putting it behind me.

    Again, I wish you the best of luck.

    Regards,
    Tracy Norris
    Pegasus Powder Coating

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    New Orleans, LA
    Posts
    953
    tbird88--
    So your caught red-handed, face the facts! Or now are you going to change your character to sound like your the victims. Your a poor SOAB........god speed on your soul!

    Calvin

    [edit]
    This has developed on the Classifieds board, I moved it here because there's some double-talk goin' on that needs to be straightened out.
    Like I said, your a shady individual. I like that you brought it here so everyone can see your TRUE colors! Thanks so much!

    I'm glad this is in the open, so next time I'm in Houston, maybe we can have a face to face!
    [/edit]
    Last edited by FearThis SC; 09-26-2002 at 04:53 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Tejas...home of Stevie Ray Vaughan
    Posts
    1,748
    Originally posted by PegasusPowder

    Again, I have no problem with you at all. It is through my own trust that I showed you how I performed my powder coating. Had I known, in advance, that you were looking to duplicate my business model then certainly you can understand what my position on that would have been.

    Your assumptions/accusations have been and still are ridiculous. Read my first post again, the facts are there. You keep choosing to ignore 'em then there ain't nuthin' I can do about that.


    Insofar as my relationship with my brother is concerned, I will explain it to you as I explained it to him. "I am judged by the people, and the ethics of those people, that I associate with. You recommended I associate with this person and, given the breach of trust that has occured, I hold you responsible". It was then that I bid him and his a happy farewell.

    Spare me.


    I implore you to understand that I mean you no disrespect or ill will, on the contrary, I wish you and yours the very best of luck in whatever you wish to do. Me, and my business, are very well respected in the groups that I perform work for. I can not, under any circumstances, allow that reputation to be dulled by any association that those groups may find "questionable".

    This is the last I have to say about this matter, and am putting it behind me.

    Again, I wish you the best of luck.

    Regards,
    Tracy Norris
    Pegasus Powder Coating

    First you attack my character based on assumptions, blame your brother for the whole thing, then you wish me the best.
    You've totally lost me.

    'bird

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Pullman Washington
    Posts
    1,427

    Exclamation Xcuse me...???

    I think I may have some light to shed on this undermining of ones honesty and charector...

    I just received a TOP from Wynn "AKA TBIRD88"

    We are not pals, we have spoken on the phone once.."He Called Me" nobody I have ever did business with on this forum has ever called me to ask for input/ideas...He did not want anything, he was not selling me anything, he was just being "Wynn"...

    I ordered the TOP from Wynn some weeks ago, and expected it on my doorstep quite awhile before I finally saw it...

    BUT...He always replied to my inquiries about it and what the hold up was, and I in turn told him over and over that I was interested in a quality job and that time was not an issue with me...So I have no complaints about the time issue...

    I also asked him to look into another type of coating similar to Dan Worleys' or I would just want the TOP in raw form to get it done elsewhere...He then sent me a few pics of what he had found and I expressed pleasure in the looks of it...

    Then he mentioned that he needed to have it redone cuz it turned out like ~~~~~ the first time around...Then he got back with me again and mentioned that it looked like **** AGAIN, and that he had just sent it back regardless, and said I would probably want to get it coated elsewhere...

    Well I do want to get it done elsewhere, and whoever did the coating job hopefully does not do this for his or her only income cuz the job was ~~~~~ in my honest opinion...There are air bubbles,
    dust and dirt fragments, and on the corners the coating color has separated from another part of the coating or something...It is smooth but looked cracked...The underside of the collar is major orangpeeled, and in my opinion the mounting surface should have been taped off...I would attach a pic but my camera won't do well enough to show the flaws in the coating...

    It is obvious to me why Wynn is trying to powder coat on his own, he simply is not satisfied with the finished look of his hard metal cratsmanship, and can appreciate a job well sone...

    Now on the other hand I must say that the CRAFTSMENSHIP is spot on, clean work done by "WYNN" and his partner I guess...Regardless I see no flaws in the metal work, it looks to be a very nice piece of work...It has the slant, and the origional look as you can see in the pics provided...And he sent me a "FULL SET" of teflon gaskets rather than just the 2 required to do the job..

    SO....When you are trying to decide whether or not this guy is OK, I think you may want to consider the source of your need to ponder the thought in the first place...I wold not say it if it was not what I have experienced, and believe to be true....

    Also I will add that I have in no way spoken with Wynn about this so don't even think about questioning my honesty on this one...Question your own before you reply in regards to my motive to respond...

    Cheers...

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    5
    Cudaz,

    I do have pictures of the underside of the top I performed the work on and it does not show any of the defects you mentioned. If you wish, then I will happily email you the pictures.

    So as not to cast doubt on ANY of the powder coating community, please accept, with no strings attached, a FREE powdercoating of your modified top (in your choice of colors) with my regards. Although you will have to pay shipping to me, I will cover all labor, cost of materials and shipping back to you to show that powder coating really will give you the look you want.

    TBird88 is by far, one of the best machinest (if not THE best) that I have run across. His work on the SC tops is second-to-none, and that I have never doubted. Anyone purchasing his products would be well-served by this statement.

    Although I am an old-school Ford Maverick dude (derisive laughter starts here), I am coming to appreciate the passion the SC crowd has for their special cars... kind of like us Maverick guys! (grin).

    Anyway, please check my website for the address and send your top ASAP. It will be cleaned, smoothed (to remove any casting flaws), glass-bead blasted, polished and finally powder coated in your choice of colors for no charge.

    Regards,
    Tracy Norris
    Pegasus Powder Coating

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Vernon, BC
    Posts
    1,926
    Tracy: I am not sure if this is possible in the powder coating technology, but would you be able to powdercoat my ic tubes/sc top black, but have the lines and letters blue? Could you do a two color powdercoat? Right now I have it painted and it is holding up pretty good, but I wouldn't mind something more permanent,

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Tejas...home of Stevie Ray Vaughan
    Posts
    1,748

    Re: Xcuse me...???

    [QUOTE][size=1]Originally posted by cudaz101

    (/lil' bit of an edit)

    I also asked him to look into another type of coating similar to Dan Worleys' or I would just want the TOP in raw form to get it done elsewhere...He then sent me a few pics of what he had found and I expressed pleasure in the looks of it...

    I would have loved to used a coating similar to Dan's but it's not sumthin' I can get into, doubt I can sell enough of locally. I think he uses an HPC-type coating, I doubt anything beats it for durability etc.


    Then he mentioned that he needed to have it redone cuz it turned out like ~~~~~ the first time around...Then he got back with me again and mentioned that it looked like **** AGAIN, and that he had just sent it back regardless, and said I would probably want to get it coated elsewhere...

    ..and I forgot to give you a partial refund (my bad, I got in a hurry).


    Well I do want to get it done elsewhere, and whoever did the coating job hopefully does not do this for his or her only income cuz the job was ~~~~~ in my honest opinion...There are air bubbles,
    dust and dirt fragments, and on the corners the coating color has separated from another part of the coating or something...It is smooth but looked cracked...The underside of the collar is major orangpeeled, and in my opinion the mounting surface should have been taped off...I would attach a pic but my camera won't do well enough to show the flaws in the coating...

    Ya sittin' down? Guilty as charged...That lowsy coating was mine. I mentioned how crummy it was in my email the other day didn't I? I mentioned that you would be stripping it because I flubbed it in my hurry to get it out the door. Part of the blame is the Ford aluminum but of course the total job is still my responsibility.

    side note...By the way, the pics you saw before were of another top, not the one you have. That other top had a factory flange and loads of pinholes. The one I sent you has one of my machined flanges on it (not bad huh?). It has a few pinholes but hopefully whatever coating you use will hide them.
    The pics of that "other top" were on my webpage until the other day, it had been base-coated but hadn't been topped with clear powder yet. Things look totally different after top-coating, just wish they didn't look like the one I sent you ( !!!). I took the pics down because I didn't want anyone drawin' the wrong conclusions and thinkin' leroy-knows-what.

    Anyhooz, just wanted to clear things up. Glad you're happy (to a certain extent) with the top but sure do wish I could've delivered better on the coating. Hopefully it won't be long before the tops will look as good as the valve covers I've done. Then again, maybe Santa will bring me that HPC rig...

    'bird

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    5

    Lightbulb

    Originally posted by Tazer999
    Tracy: I am not sure if this is possible in the powder coating technology, but would you be able to powdercoat my ic tubes/sc top black, but have the lines and letters blue? Could you do a two color powdercoat? Right now I have it painted and it is holding up pretty good, but I wouldn't mind something more permanent,
    Tazer,

    Yep! I can handle your request... but.... Whoa! I have to be careful with two-color jobs. They are expensive labor-wise!

    Let me explain. First, you have to do the raised portions in blue (the lines & letters) and mask off everything else (entire body) in high-temp tape (to stand up to the 400 degree cure temp). Once that has set, then I have to remove that masking and THEN mask only the lettering and lines (to keep them from becoming contaminated with the base color) and shoot the base color.

    Powder coating has a roughly 30 year lifespan. Since it was developed in the '70s and most of those jobs are still going strong, who is to say what the life-limit is on a powder coating job?

    I'll be honest with you. For simple valve cover I normally charge $99.95 (clean, debur, polish and coat) but for a custom two-color job, I'll add roughly double the price because it is actually two powder coating jobs added to one item.

    It IS possible, and you will have results that nobody else can come close to matching, but you WILL pay for it. It will last darned near forever with only Windex to clean it, but you pay heavily for the award-winning job you get. Only you can judge if your SC is worth it.

    Attached, please find a (laughter starts here), Ford Escort 1.9L cover done in red over white.

    Us powder coaters are hankerin' for the SC business, just give us a chance!

    Regards,
    Tracy Norris
    Pegasus Powder Coating
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by PegasusPowder; 09-27-2002 at 02:22 AM.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Tejas...home of Stevie Ray Vaughan
    Posts
    1,748
    Pegasus,

    You come on these boards attacking my character,
    questioning my ethics,
    and now you have the nerve to advertise in this thread.

    ?

    'bird

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Vernon, BC
    Posts
    1,926
    So it would cost a pretty penny to get this done huh

    Powdercoat the supercharger, ic, and all plumbing behind the supercharger gloss black. Powdercoat the upper ic tube, lower ic tube, and sc top gloss black with ford gloss blue on letters and lines

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    5
    Tbird88,

    Tazer asked a question and I responded. I'm not sure where the concern is in that. Insofar as attacking anybodys character, I've found that I have never needed to do that. Most people are fully capable of handling that themselves through thier own actions.

    * * * *

    Tazer, email me at tnorris@houston.rr.com and we can communicate about your project without cluttering up the boards.

    Thanks,
    Pegasus

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    222
    ive said it before and ill say it again wynn is the man i got my b*tchin gasket and the best damn dry rub steak seaoning ont he planet i was able to "powder coat" a tbone and it was great and that speaks volumes to me

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •