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Thread: Fuel Cell/Pump Pics

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by 90sc35thann View Post
    LOL. We should be very upset with these Ford engineers. LOL They didn't do us any favors.
    ........... I'm a Ford engineer, in engine manufacturing not system design though.
    Last edited by rzimmerl; 05-01-2012 at 09:37 PM.
    SCCoA Member#: 2515
    1990 SC AOD 2.1L Kenne Bell
    11.676 @ 121.35 mph
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  2. #122
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    double post
    Last edited by rzimmerl; 05-01-2012 at 09:43 PM.
    SCCoA Member#: 2515
    1990 SC AOD 2.1L Kenne Bell
    11.676 @ 121.35 mph
    506hp/478tq
    My Garage

  3. #123
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    double post
    Last edited by rzimmerl; 05-01-2012 at 09:42 PM.
    SCCoA Member#: 2515
    1990 SC AOD 2.1L Kenne Bell
    11.676 @ 121.35 mph
    506hp/478tq
    My Garage

  4. #124
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    double post
    Last edited by 90sc35thann; 05-01-2012 at 09:36 PM.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenewagner View Post
    Your first statement was it is the biggest restriction, for me that is likely correct at this time but since it provides me with adquate fuel to the 60lb injectors while using a 2.3L twinscrew and making over 400 rwhp, I doubt most will find the fuel rail restrictive at all. A statement like that can lead sombody to think they need to up grade fuel rail and in reality could spend money in better places. I think Ryan was making over 440 rwhp with the stock rail. So in general thinking I dont see the the fuel rail as a problem restriction. Now if you want to look closely at the stock lines running under the car, they look really restrictive.

    Ken
    If you are running #60 injectors X 6 = 360 pounds of fuel an hour. If fuel weighs about 6.07 pounds per gallon. That said each injector will flow 9.88 gallons per hour. 9.88 x 6 = 59.28 gallons per hour. Of course I am assuming you run at 100% duty cycle. So let's de-rate that to 90% and you get 53.35 gallons per hour. Divide that by 60 seconds and you get .88 gallons per minute. I guess the biggest question is will our stock fuel rail flow roughly a gallon of fuel per minute at 60 psi. if so then you are good.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by rzimmerl View Post
    ........... I'm a Ford engineer, in engine manufacturing not system design though.
    The engine building is just fine. :-) My ecoboost F-150 isn't making any noises or leaking any fluid. We are good.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickleman60 View Post
    The last thing I had to do was get the stock fuel gauge working with the new fuel cell. The cell came with a 0-90 ohm sending unit which we all know isn't the correct range, even so with a full tank (10 gal.) the gauge would read between 1/4 & 1/2 tank. I searched on here and found that the stock sending unit has a range of 18 to 160 or somewhere close to those ohm numbers. The closest I could find was a universal sending unit with 10-180 ohm range. I removed the extension bracket so it would be shorter than the 9" cell depth, it ended up being 6.5" long. Figured out how long the float needed to be to touch the bottom and top of tank, cut it and mounted it in the cell. Now the fuel gauge reads full to empty. I know it will be off some because of the slight difference in ohm ranges but I can live with it.


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  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by 90sc35thann View Post
    If you are running #60 injectors X 6 = 360 pounds of fuel an hour. If fuel weighs about 6.07 pounds per gallon. That said each injector will flow 9.88 gallons per hour. 9.88 x 6 = 59.28 gallons per hour. Of course I am assuming you run at 100% duty cycle. So let's de-rate that to 90% and you get 53.35 gallons per hour. Divide that by 60 seconds and you get .88 gallons per minute. I guess the biggest question is will our stock fuel rail flow roughly a gallon of fuel per minute at 60 psi. if so then you are good.

    Math was never a strong point of mine. I beleive the restriction in the fuel line is not the fuel rail. I beleive it is the lines running under the car. The fuel rail looks to be 3/8" in diameter but the lines under the car from the fuel tank look to be about 5/16" ID. Most of the guys that have done major upgrades did the pump first, than voltage upgrade to the pump, than fuel lines to the fuel rail. So I feel the fuel rail is adquate for a high performance SC. With the new thing being 80lb injectors, 95 MM TBs and so on and so on. The fuel rail will probably be a needed upgrade.

    Ken

    93 SC Whipple powered 11.648 @ 119.6
    Twin Turbo, air intercooled..yet to see

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenewagner View Post
    Math was never a strong point of mine. I beleive the restriction in the fuel line is not the fuel rail. I beleive it is the lines running under the car. The fuel rail looks to be 3/8" in diameter but the lines under the car from the fuel tank look to be about 5/16" ID. Most of the guys that have done major upgrades did the pump first, than voltage upgrade to the pump, than fuel lines to the fuel rail. So I feel the fuel rail is adquate for a high performance SC. With the new thing being 80lb injectors, 95 MM TBs and so on and so on. The fuel rail will probably be a needed upgrade.

    Ken
    The rail is 5/16 ID feed with a 1/4 ID return. There are points on the rail where it narrows down further as the bends are kink style bends. You will certainly achieve less frictional loss by replacing the lengthy skinny fuel line from the trunk to the rail and you will also have less pressure loss to the rail but then you are right back to using a 5/16 ID fuel rail.

  10. #130
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    That looks really nice Keith - good job. I have to ask though, do you ever put anything in your trunk? I'm just wondering about stuff rolling around in there.

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Micahdogg View Post
    That looks really nice Keith - good job. I have to ask though, do you ever put anything in your trunk? I'm just wondering about stuff rolling around in there.
    yes I put stuff in the trunk...........gas and nitrous.............
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  12. #132
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    The stock rail will flow enough fuel to make over 500 rwhp using gasoline and large injectors with a voltage boosted 255 lph high pressure pump and stock fuel lines. Chris Wise's 4.2 turbocharged SC had this setup and ran 10.6 @ 130 on drag radials.

    Most of the people making over 400 rwhp are using modified stock rails that have a 6AN fitting attached to each end of the rail (inlet & outlet) then use a remote mounted regulator. Feeding each rail (3 injectors) with a 6AN supply hose will provide plenty of fuel for just about level of power you are likely to reach with a roots or twin screw blower.

    I think bigger rails should be considered when using E85 and trying to exceed 450 rwhp with a roots or twin screw blower, because of the additional 30% of fuel volume required compared to using gasoline at the same power level.

    David
    1991 SC AOD 4.2..2.3 Whipple..........10.910 @ 125.61
    2016 SRT Challenger Hellcat...............707HP/650TQ

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  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by 90sc35thann View Post
    The rail is 5/16 ID feed with a 1/4 ID return. There are points on the rail where it narrows down further as the bends are kink style bends. You will certainly achieve less frictional loss by replacing the lengthy skinny fuel line from the trunk to the rail and you will also have less pressure loss to the rail but then you are right back to using a 5/16 ID fuel rail.

    The fuel line does constitutes the biggest restriction in the system for flow. Its a smaller ID size than the fuel rail. The fuel rail as is well support lots of HP if you get the fuel to it. Thats why the first recommendation eveyone makes is a bigger fuel pump. Second recommendation would be larger fuel lines to the fuel rail and than last of all custom fuel rails. I cut a section of fuel line and took a picture of it next to a fuel rail that is cut to extend it for a bigger blower. Daddy always said a picture is worth a 1000 words.

    Ken
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    93 SC Whipple powered 11.648 @ 119.6
    Twin Turbo, air intercooled..yet to see

  14. #134
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    Keith, or anyone else with a cell. When they give you measurements is the sump included in the depth or is that extra? Say the measurements are 17x17x9, the 9 being how tall or deep it is, is the cube part 9" deep and then the 2" sump is 11" from the top of the tank?
    ~Chris
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  15. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by BLOWN38 View Post
    Keith, or anyone else with a cell. When they give you measurements is the sump included in the depth or is that extra? Say the measurements are 17x17x9, the 9 being how tall or deep it is, is the cube part 9" deep and then the 2" sump is 11" from the top of the tank?
    The sump is extra depth Chris.
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