Winter projects

Ken, do you plan to run a trans brake?

Well everyone I know said that is the way to go. Right now I have so many things left to do, as you having built a turbo setup know, I will be happy to just get it up and running for now.

Ken
 
Well everyone I know said that is the way to go. Right now I have so many things left to do, as you having built a turbo setup know, I will be happy to just get it up and running for now.

Ken

I know exactlly what you mean. You might not need a brake to run 10's, wont really know til you get it going. There are a few tricks to spool on the line. I'm going to play around with this 2 step and play with the tune so I sould have some results on this I'll pass along.

I will say though, going from a blown motor to a turbo setup does take some getting use to. But once you get the turbo setup dialed in there is nothing else like it. The power spike and top end pull of is very addicting lol.
 
Very cool stuff. Nice fab work. How could you not twin charge this thing, you to the skills to do it, and will make the car even more unique. Fake everyone with an M90 and stock pulleys. :D
 
Bolted in rear exhaust and by pass pipes. Installed the new Bora mufflers. I have to stop at this point and drop the tranny pan to repair a leak and install a new cast extra deep pan. I can than finish the exhaust to the engine. Also plan to modify the rear tranny mount to give me a bit more room for the return. Still a few months away with all the extras parts to finish. Anyway more pictures as promised. Off to Quaeker Steak and Lube for lunch with a few local SC guys.

Ken
 

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Forgot to add a picture of the intake box off the turbos.:rolleyes:

Ken
 

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Hard to tell since I cant see, but are your turbos perfectly level, with the oil inlet and outlets at or near 90degrees perfect vertical.
 
Ken,

In regards to weight disribution. With your fab skills you can create a track only resevour system that is larger and in the trunk. Then for teh street simply remove it and put somethng smaller in. That way you dont have to worry about on the street weight distribution for handeling.
 
Some considerations I'll just throw out.

#1 - Hump hoses. Make sure you use them where you attached stuff to the motor that is attached to hard points on the frame.

#2 - hump hoses. On the pressure side, they will expand as boost increases and it pushes on the sides of the hose. So don't get things too tight. Also, have spares. It is this movement from pressure changes that wears them out, eventually leading to a leak.

To pick a reservoir size you should test your pluming and pump. Run the pump and dump the return water into a 5 gallon bucket and time how long it takes to fill the bucket (or some portion). That'll let you know how fast you can consume water. With the pump rating, you should be able to figure out what your system head pressure is. Then see if you can fix some things creating that head pressure.

With my AFCO dual pass heat exchanger and Spearco intercooler core, I was seeing temp increases of up to 40F from green light to win light on a 1/4 track. From coasting to picking up the time slip, ACT temps would drop back down to just below ambient temp (still some ice left).

Testing my pump showed it was moving around 1 gallon in 13 seconds. I had a 4 gallon system. I never got to test if I could move 2 gallons in the same time, what impact that would have on ACT. But I believe, I would have seen less ACT rise over the length of the run. So don't hesitate to benchmark some of your plumbing ahead of time. After you get some data logs going down the track you'll get some better ideas on what to do. But if you optimize your system now, maybe you won't see a need to change anything.

As for adding ice. The tank I had had about a 4" opening to add water/ice. And some of the bag ice you get has big chunks and I had to break them to get it in. At the track you'll go through lots of Ice. I went through 60 lbs and still ran out. It melts, and sitting in staging lanes uses it up pretty quick.
 
Some considerations I'll just throw out.

#1 - Hump hoses. Make sure you use them where you attached stuff to the motor that is attached to hard points on the frame.

#2 - hump hoses. On the pressure side, they will expand as boost increases and it pushes on the sides of the hose. So don't get things too tight. Also, have spares. It is this movement from pressure changes that wears them out, eventually leading to a leak.

To pick a reservoir size you should test your pluming and pump. Run the pump and dump the return water into a 5 gallon bucket and time how long it takes to fill the bucket (or some portion). That'll let you know how fast you can consume water. With the pump rating, you should be able to figure out what your system head pressure is. Then see if you can fix some things creating that head pressure.

With my AFCO dual pass heat exchanger and Spearco intercooler core, I was seeing temp increases of up to 40F from green light to win light on a 1/4 track. From coasting to picking up the time slip, ACT temps would drop back down to just below ambient temp (still some ice left).

Testing my pump showed it was moving around 1 gallon in 13 seconds. I had a 4 gallon system. I never got to test if I could move 2 gallons in the same time, what impact that would have on ACT. But I believe, I would have seen less ACT rise over the length of the run. So don't hesitate to benchmark some of your plumbing ahead of time. After you get some data logs going down the track you'll get some better ideas on what to do. But if you optimize your system now, maybe you won't see a need to change anything.

As for adding ice. The tank I had had about a 4" opening to add water/ice. And some of the bag ice you get has big chunks and I had to break them to get it in. At the track you'll go through lots of Ice. I went through 60 lbs and still ran out. It melts, and sitting in staging lanes uses it up pretty quick.

Good information;) I will look at hump hoses at that point. I spent a lot of time on the cadillac STS forms. They have posted a lot on upgrading the Bosch pump to the Jabsco pump. They performed a lot of tests including the bucket test and even had the bucket at diffrent height. One guy even put two Jabsco pumps in series really increasing the flow. I was impressed with the amount of detail they went to on this subject. I figured I would lose a lot of ice while racing. I am not thinking I can run ice on every run down the 1/4. Dont know how one can get that done every run. I can see using it on the quarter for a best run or the dyno for a top number. On the other hand it would be an advantage on race days like the shootout last year where the temps and or humidty are not idea. Anyway thanks for all the info and suggestions

Ken
 
Ken,

I'm very impressed with how tightly you have been able to package everything. This is also the first time I can recall seeing someone using part of the supporting framework to feed exhaust to the turbos. In these pics it looks like the turbine housing is bolted to a matching flange that is welded to a short piece of square or rectangular tubing that is welded to the supporting structure, and exhaust from the motor is feed into the side of that square or rectangular tubing.

Is this something you have seen done on other STS remote mounts, or just something you are trying ?

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David
 
Ken,

I'm very impressed with how tightly you have been able to package everything. This is also the first time I can recall seeing someone using part of the supporting framework to feed exhaust to the turbos. In these pics it looks like the turbine housing is bolted to a matching flange that is welded to a short piece of square or rectangular tubing that is welded to the supporting structure, and exhaust from the motor is feed into the side of that square or rectangular tubing.

Is this something you have seen done on other STS remote mounts, or just something you are trying ?


David

I started with a 10ga steel bracket and reinforced it for strength. The base that the turbos bolt to is fabricated and welded solid to the bracket. It is formed to promote flow into the turbine side. It gives the Turbos a ridgid mounting. Ive done V bands through out the entire exhaust for easy of dissasemble. I have flex tubing before and after the turbos to allow expansion and vibration to occur without stressing the turbos. There is a lot of room without the stock fuel tank in place. I still have the water pump and two oil pumps to install. The oil pumps will mount under the air box. I have never done any kind of installation like this. I spent a lot of time on the internet looking at other installations. In most cases I could see flaws in others work and quality work in others and took the best of ideas and tried to put together something that made sense. I got carried away on the exhaust. I could have used the old mufflers and 31/2" center section but couldnt figure how to make it flow well coming off the exhaust side of the turbo. Everyone seems to love the Bora mufflers so I have high hopes the exhaust will be almost stock sounding at idle and still fairly reserved at WOT

Ken
 
Sound will be fine until the turbos spool up. That frequency of sound is higher pitched than automotive mufflers are designed to silence. Should sound cool.

Thought of something else that i was going to do, but never got around to. Adding a sacrificial anode to the intercoolers heat exchange system. You may want to add support for a screw in zinc anode into your reservoir tank. You can find them through some marine sites. They are available in a style where they screw on through a bung, and have a ground line you can attach. I used a meter with my system and didn't see any voltage being formed, but it was new then. As water works on the aluminum it can start a process of corrosion.

You will want to also be able to get the water out of the system as well as bleed air out of the system. That may require a bleed valve at the high point in the system, and a drain at a low point.

Air/liquid systems are a bit fiddly.

oh, and a note how fluid pumps work In series, they allow you to move more for a given head. In parallel they allow you to move the same flow but for a greater head. In series though they will never get higher than their max output at zero pressure. These pumps are typically centrifugal, not roots so they don't compound in series like a roots blower.

What that means is that if you have a pump rated for 6gpm and in your system head pressure causes it to be 4.5gpm, adding another pump in series could recover that 1.5gpm lost to head but it won't get you 9gpm. All approximate, but should give you an idea of what to do to achieve what you need.
 
Sound will be fine until the turbos spool up. That frequency of sound is higher pitched than automotive mufflers are designed to silence. Should sound cool.

Thought of something else that i was going to do, but never got around to. Adding a sacrificial anode to the intercoolers heat exchange system. You may want to add support for a screw in zinc anode into your reservoir tank. You can find them through some marine sites. They are available in a style where they screw on through a bung, and have a ground line you can attach. I used a meter with my system and didn't see any voltage being formed, but it was new then. As water works on the aluminum it can start a process of corrosion.

You will want to also be able to get the water out of the system as well as bleed air out of the system. That may require a bleed valve at the high point in the system, and a drain at a low point.

Air/liquid systems are a bit fiddly.




oh, and a note how fluid pumps work In series, they allow you to move more for a given head. In parallel they allow you to move the same flow but for a greater head. In series though they will never get higher than their max output at zero pressure. These pumps are typically centrifugal, not roots so they don't compound in series like a roots blower.

What that means is that if you have a pump rated for 6gpm and in your system head pressure causes it to be 4.5gpm, adding another pump in series could recover that 1.5gpm lost to head but it won't get you 9gpm. All approximate, but should give you an idea of what to do to achieve what you need.

The anode thing i have never heard of so that is new information. Guess I will have look into installing something. Learn something new everyday. The pumps in series I understand. I felt the doubling of the pumps was more than I wanted to do. The Jabsco pump is 200 bucks another one would be an additional 200 bucks. I am feeling like the one will work just fine. Happy to have your imput though so I get it right the first time

Ken
 
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