Support group

There's some great stories and analogies in this thread. I'll weigh in......I still check in here on a weekly basis, as I am no longer an SC owner, but many of the people here were so great and helpful that I still enjoy coming here.

In 2014, I'd got my first SC, a white 1991. It was a rebuilt salvage title car, but the previous owners (a guy named Jeff and his father) had done a very good job of piecing things together from parts cars. The car drove well and had no apparent problems, and I was excited to own one of these. The supercharged engine was a great starting point, but when I had read more about all of the unique things that the cars had, I was even more of a fan.

I took it to the local Sunday car show for the first time in 2015, and most people walked by it with no real interest or anything. But the guys that were into the car were REALLY into it, because they knew what it was. I remember a guy, Rennie, coming up and talking about it and knowing a fair bit, but being surprised that the tweed/ leather combo was a factory option (he only knew of leather seats). A father and his son came up, Bob and Chris, and even invited me back to their house to talk cars and hang out and have a beer. I did, and they were super cool guys--Ford guys, too. It was a blast.

Some people may remember my story here, I think the thread title was something like "you're not gonna believe this". I was wrenching on my SC on the front street, and a girl had stopped in front of a driveway......very haphazard, and improper. She stepped out of her car and asked, "....is that your car?". I was kind of wary, because of the quick temporary parking job that she did, as well as the excited, almost nervous tone in her voice. I was thinking "oh crap, I cut ice queen off in traffic somewhere, and she remembered the licence plate '1FSTBRD' and is gonna yell at me or something. GREAT". I answered that it was my car, and she responds with something that I honestly did not see coming....."nice car! So I finally meet the person that owns this car. It's beautiful!!". You can imagine that this is like a movie or something that I'd be watching, except that I'm in it. Pretty and tall girl Kate turns out to be this super cool girl that I ask for her number to hang out sometime, and she gives it to me. I wish that I had this on video for you guys, because it was an awesome moment over a car. She turned out to be a "Ford girl" and had to "roll with the Ford jokes.....'found on road dead', you know". She doesn't like her current Ford Focus, because it's a company car and she likes something with more character......hence the like for the 'Bird.

When I did a CarFax, the car was in two accidents before I'd got it: one major one for $7800 or so, then a second one for $2500. A third one happened when I had the car for $2000 or so (which originally was around $3200 but I had helped keep the cost low by having the bumper be re-painted and the driver's turn signal lens be replaced). This third one was a hit and run in a parking lot (some may remember a couple of years back that I had posted a picture from a witness that saw the Nissan Rogue that hit my car and left a fake phone number). I won that case! Imagine the jerk's surprise when they had the insurance company contacting them, even with a false phone number given! That's karma for you. So I kind of feel like this particular SC cheated the odds, because the adjuster said that with the second accident, it shouldn't have been back on the road, and especially with this third one, I think that the overall good condition of the car (and my stack of receipts for upgrades and things) kept it on the road to see another day. Any car with $13,000 worth of damage or so is going to be an insurance liability, yet this car seemed to have nine lives. The best part was that the Rogue had pretty much completely messed up the right side of their vehicle (according to my witness), yet the Bird had just minor cosmetic damage to the bumper, and the driver's side turn signal lens was laying on the ground.

My experience with the SC in terms of the power not being enough, is probably a lot like many of yours. At first, you're amazed at what the blown 3.8 can do in terms of burnouts and laying a strip of rubber on the ground, but then it's not quite enough. When you're cruising down the highway and pin the throttle, it feels much slower than in that first gear off the line. And so it begins! I'd bought a whole bunch of things off not only some people on here, but also from Bill at SC Performance. Then I really went further and did the cam and heads and Quarterhorse. I had did my 3.8 Mustang heads and cam just a month prior to that, which already shares some similar components (ie: coil pack, oil filter, etc) and everything ran fine. I learned how to shim for pushrods, torqueing the cylinder heads and what an art that is, etc. The car fired right up, no problem, so I was feeling confident about working on the SC.......and confident about making some serious power. With all of the mods on my SC, I'd got a 0-60 on the highway down to the low 6 second range (depending on traction), and this was on the stock 30 lb injectors, and I hadn't blown up the engine or the head gaskets or anything, so I was feeling even more confident about the upgrade to heads and a cam. I had already replaced the blower with a ported late model one, had installed a DIC, done my own spark plug job, etc, so I was fairly familiar with the workings of the SC engine.

The SC, on the other hand, after the cam/ heads swap had a nasty slow crank condition that the car wouldn't fire. Some people may remember this thread at about this time last year. I tried everything......new battery, crank position sensor, DIS, ECU, checked all fuses, grounds, tested all wiring with a continuity tester, new ignition switch, etc etc. I tested all the wires from the DIC to the crank sensor, coil pack, etc. I ran the diagnostic EEC test, and everything came up fine (of course). I troubleshooted things every night for probably a month and a half or so.......frustration continually mounting with each night and each week, and as the days turned into weeks and with the nights getting shorter, which started turning into months going into the late fall, I had to make a decision: tow the car to my storage facility (not close, so it would have been an expensive tow) and store it until next spring, or try to sell it complete--with a rebuilt title and a no-start condition. I tried to sell it for $1700, which I thought was fair for a car with the modifications and upgrades that this car had. No takers. Then I tried to sell it for $1200, which wouldn't have even covered the cost of the heads/ cam, let alone an installation fee. Still no takers. Then I figured that the only way that I'd be able to recover some money, would be to dismantle the engine and sell off the parts (some may remember a thread that I made in the "for sale" section that had some great go fast parts in it). So I tore the engine down and took everything off of it that I could sell, but the exterior still had some really good parts, and the interior was near flawless.

So you'd figure that it wouldn't be too difficult to sell it for maybe $500, right? Wrong. Still no takers. I ended up calling the Diabetes association for their donation cars program, thinking that they'd want it. WRONG. They only wanted complete cars! So then I called up one of my favorite wreckers that I usually go to, thinking that they'd give me maybe a couple of hundred bucks. Wrong again. I said that they can have it for free, if they tow it. They ended up waffling, saying that the free tow might not cover the cost of what they can get for the car (especially without the supercharger on it). So I ended up calling another place, and I remember a guy named Fred answering the phone. I told Fred that he can have the car for free, if he tows it. He took me up on the offer, and I was at work at the time that he had booked to tow it, so I was really hoping that the car was gone by the time that I got home.......it was taking up my parking spot and I otherwise had to park my Mustang on the street.

Finally, the car was gone, and it was with mixed feelings.......my anger at this car was approaching ridiculous levels, to the point where it was affecting the rest of my life. I felt like a failure........spent all that money, but you know what? It was almost as if the car just said that it wished that it were dead, and that it had lived out its life. It had used up its other nine lives; this was ten. Also, I was wondering that with all of the modifications, whether the car's spirit just wasn't what it originally was.......a luxury sport car that was meant for comfortable, quiet power, and not screaming, loud power. I kind of felt that in my pursuit of power (like some have mentioned here) has turned their car into something that is spiritually not its own anymore, and that by trying to turn it into an out and out performance car, that its lost its uniqueness.

But I had so many great stories that were associated with the car, and there were times that I enjoyed feeling like I was a part of a secret club, you know? It's something that I still miss. But I don't think that I'll ever own another SC again, just because I think that I'll always want it to be something that it's not. If I want a performance car, I'm just getting a performance car. If I want a daily driver, I'm just getting a daily driver that is better on fuel. If I want something luxurious, then it's just a cruiser, grandpa style. Sometimes we can be guilty of wanting something to be too many things, and that's often when it starts to fail at all of those things.
 
Great story,

Maybe you have a point about the cars abilities in today's world. It seems very few will go bananas modding the car at this stage most are happy to just keep them running.

There are 4 types of owners/club member. The majority are folks that just want to keep the car running or bring it back to operating standard after the last previous owner handed it off. Then there is the handful that keep them in garages and are Low mileage examples, these owners are stuck with them cause nobody is willing to pay what they are really worth. Those that appreciate it's value and are willing to pay the price already have an SC so there goes that Idea. The third kind Are the young insired crowd won't pay up for the collectible but are willing to build it up, they have some connection about the car family or memory, and mod the living Jesus out of it to catch up to the top dogs in the club, some quit when the road get tough some persevere and pull through and end up with empty wallets in the end. Then there is veterans that has sunk so much money restoring and modding that theire is no turning back they know all too well about the shuffle. There are one or two engineers and craftsman in that category, and their skills allows them to keep the costs down.

So the car is a niche, and getting through frustration seems to go hand in hand with ownership. What's appealing though is that when you get the speed bug this club recognizes you and congratulates you for your persistence and hard work because they know all too well that you did something unique and went against logic to get there.

Was It a smart idea? Not one bit, but was it cool doing it? Most here will agree it is.
 
Great story,

Maybe you have a point about the cars abilities in today's world. It seems very few will go bananas modding the car at this stage most are happy to just keep them running.

There are 4 types of owners/club member. The majority are folks that just want to keep the car running or bring it back to operating standard after the last previous owner handed it off. Then there is the handful that keep them in garages and are Low mileage examples, these owners are stuck with them cause nobody is willing to pay what they are really worth. Those that appreciate it's value and are willing to pay the price already have an SC so there goes that Idea. The third kind Are the young insired crowd won't pay up for the collectible but are willing to build it up, they have some connection about the car family or memory, and mod the living Jesus out of it to catch up to the top dogs in the club, some quit when the road get tough some persevere and pull through and end up with empty wallets in the end. Then there is veterans that has sunk so much money restoring and modding that theire is no turning back they know all too well about the shuffle. There are one or two engineers and craftsman in that category, and their skills allows them to keep the costs down.

So the car is a niche, and getting through frustration seems to go hand in hand with ownership. What's appealing though is that when you get the speed bug this club recognizes you and congratulates you for your persistence and hard work because they know all too well that you did something unique and went against logic to get there.

Was It a smart idea? Not one bit, but was it cool doing it? Most here will agree it is.
I'm in a couple of the categories I was somewhat young when I started but now I'm 44. As far as money is concerned thats where I dont really care its just money a nd you can't take it with you however I have most of all of the big expenses out of the way finally.
 
I'm in a couple of the categories I was somewhat young when I started but now I'm 44. As far as money is concerned thats where I dont really care its just money a nd you can't take it with you however I have most of all of the big expenses out of the way finally.

That's a subjective statement, if it's in your budget by all means. I used to think like that, now it's college for the kids, good retirement and keeping my head above water, for the average sc owner they are probably are just starting at life. So I would advice to be a little wiser with their car addiction.
 
Thanks for the props, what's your name?

My name is Lazaro-- and I think I'm squarely in the 1st group. I've had my 92 black automatic about 10 yrs and a 93white 5spd for about 4 yrs (which I did in fact take for spin yesterday) I've proven myself more stubborner than a SC twice over. My 92 was a back up car I bought at tow yard lein sale. I ended up loaning it to my father-in-law who loaned it to my brother-in-law...In about 4 wks he managed to wreck the driver fender and door and blow the headgaskets. Out of sheer stubborness i wouldn't junk it. That turned in to finding this forum --resealing a late model long block, ported late model blower 75mm tb dual core ic. bhc dampner arp studs...underdrive pulleys 5% jackshaft. I replaced the fender and door and sprayed the whole car single stage gloss black. My 80 yr old dad has been driving daily for about 3 yrs or so and still gets it moving on occasion. my 93 belonged to a CA old time SCCOA member Elbert Dooley. He just wanted it go to someone to get it going again and let me have it for $500. It was practically a shelf for his garage and were a coy miller engine used to be-- a hamper. good bones though..straight, no rust 5 spd 3:55 gears and trunk full of parts including headers, centerforce clutch..over about 3 yrs i battled a lein on the car from a defunct credit union.. several trips to the DMV and several hundred dollars later I have clean title. Built a early model block .030 over. late model rods.home ported the heads and had a machine shop do the valves, ported late model exhaust manifolds. mild cam from Dalke. ported late model blower / a 10% pulley,75mm TB, MP plenum FMIC 42 lb injectors. wide band and Dalke tune on the quarterhorse that is for my purposes-- dead nuts spot on. both cars were looking at the crusher..both fought me like a mutha...both on the road and registered and rolling...not perfect..not the fastest but I'm somewhat at peace with what they are. What i like most about these cars is they showed my kids taking difficult tasks--seemingly impossible is possible a bit a time. The best way to chop down a big ol' tree is 5 whacks a day. I'm in my 40s and back in school for about a yr because a mobile app is pretty much going to replace what I've been doing within the next couple years. I guess I'm the old project now!. Luckily I'm stubborn..5 more whacks!!
 
I'm not in any of those groups.

I bought the XR7 when it was less than a year old. It was wrecked. Totalled. I fixed it. I had $9k in an $18K car. I was fresh out of college and newly married. I didn't have 50 cents to rub together. We struggled to make the $300/mo payment on the car. Between the two of us we barely made it. During that time I focused my speed bug on a 1981 Dodge Colt I did an engine swap in that car and learned how to swap transmissions in the evenings in my apartment parking lot because it seemed to break them every time I raced someone.

I didn't do a single mod to the car until it was paid off 3 years later. Then I added a 10% pulley and a 180 deg thermostat. Cost under $100. At this point the car was about 4 years old, all my friends were modding their cars, but mine was basically stock and definitely slow. I actually hated the car during this time. I was so poor when the mufflers started rattling I cut them off but it was too loud and I couldn't afford two new mufflers, so I bought one, and had a muffler shop turn it into a single exhaust. It was embarrassing but that's all I could afford. It sounded terrible, wheezing and farting

In 96 Phil was 2 and Connie and I were both working. I could finally afford a couple minor things. I bought a chip, C&L 73mm MAF, and I built my own exhaust working in a speed shop in Texas where I exchanged my help on odd jobs around the place for the ability to work on my car there on weekends. I learned to TIG weld there. After that upgrade the car was quick enough to beat SHO's and Impala SS's. I was getting somewhere. I still kinda hated the car and almost traded it in on a Camaro.

That same year my brother in law bought a 96 Camaro SS (much to my chagrin), and went off bragging how fast it was. I challenged him to a race on the dragstrip and ended up beating him 2 out of 3. It was only at this point that I was finally hooked. I knew I could either spend my life chasing all the guys who owned the true muscle cars (Camaros and Mustangs) and had bigger budgets than me, or I could drive the XR7 and piss off just enough of them that were unsuspecting to make it fun. I knew if I bought something more popular I'd just spend my life playing catch up and I didn't have the money for that and probably never would.

So in truth the XR7 saved me a lot of money and heartache. Throughout it's modded life I promised myself never to take money off the table to mod it, and to only do things that I was pretty sure I would like. It spent many years unmodded, or slow, or boring. It did tow vehicle duty when I was autocrossing, it did truck duty when I needed to haul transmissions from the junkyard, and it did daily commuting for years and years.

In the end I couldn't tell you how much I did or didn't spend on it. Frankly it doesn't matter, because I only used pocket change to mod it anyway. How much money does one spend going out on weekends for a year? I'm sure you don't know. I don't know. It's the same with my car. To this day I don't have record of what I've spent, but none of it went on credit cards, none of it prevented anything else we might have done, and in the end idk if it actually cost me anything.

The first round of big mods for the car came in 2001 when I bought Denis Demitratos' car. I paid I think $3000 for it, and then turned around and sold parts off it until I had $0 in the mods I kept from it. I broke even on the car and ended up with a FMIC, Sport blower, 3.55 gears, Centerforce clutch, Ripper shifter, long tube headers and some worn out drag radials that eventually broke both of my axles. lol

The XR7 now sits on the side of the house rusting away because we put well over 200K on it and the body simply didn't hold up. But I have other cars now and I don't put money into them either. The fact that I'm not going to be at the Shootout this year for the first time in 15 years is further evidence to the fact that I've been disciplined somewhat over the years to do only what I can afford. In this case it's more time than money, but time = money so I guess it's the same thing in the end.

I won't ever sell my fleet of SC's. Some come and go when people show up who I think are better matches for some of them than I am. I try to spread the love when I can and I do my best to keep worthy SC's rolling. I'll be driving these I suppose when they pull my driver's license because I very seriously have enough of these to keep driving them for the rest of my useful life.

What makes it interesting to me is trying new things and reminding myself that I enjoy driving these even though I know they aren't the best cars in the world. It's kind of like your family, you all have flaws and there is always that one idiot, but you are family and you aren't going to go out and find a new one. I kind of feel like that about the SC's. Sure they have plenty of flaws, but so do I and we are family. I didn't choose the XR7 in the beginning just like you don't choose your family, it was actually chosen for me (honestly it was literally chosen for me!). I've loved it and hated it. The first time I drove it - with no windshield! - I absolutely knew I had never driven such a refined automobile - ever. I can't describe the euphoria I felt. I guess imagine driving a Bugatti. It was that good (at the time) - or maybe it was just the wind in my face, idk. It was February after all. Of course at the time my daily was a 1963 Falcon so that should help with perspective. On a side note, the first thing we did after the XR7 was back on the road was race, and the Falcon destroyed the XR7. lol

Thing that sticks out for me is that there were literally years and years when I couldn't do a single mod to the car because time and money didn't allow. It was incredibly frustrating and I don't know that there are any virtues to be gained from the experience. It just was what it was. I'm glad I didn't ditch it all those times when i nearly did. I'm sure I would have been fine modding something else or not at all even, but here I am still modding these things and its has been a good experience all in all. At this point I know I'll be driving these forever, but it's not a resignation or utopia, it just is what it is and I'm good with that.
 
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Not that I have a ton of time between work, home and family but I wish the Boston community was more active .... or active at all should I say. I'd always be willing to entertain some discussion on a get together or meeting at a show. I'm not depressed about my car even though I only put about 500 miles a year on it but it would be nice to meet some people with as bad taste in cars as me. The shootout just isn't in the cards for me.
 
That's a subjective statement, if it's in your budget by all means. I used to think like that, now it's college for the kids, good retirement and keeping my head above water, for the average sc owner they are probably are just starting at life. So I would advice to be a little wiser with their car addiction.
Yeah Kind of but if you work at it like I do not really. I dont use any of my income on this car Ricardoa. I only use bonus money expense money etc. I realize how blessed I am and thank God for it everyday. I could have easily just went out and bought a black on black GT500 or super snake but here I am building MY 25 year old car right along with the rest of you. I was in the same place alot of you were back in 2002 or so when I bought my first sc I could barely afford to put 93 octane in it but I loved that car and it is why this car exists. As my girls get older I know life's priorities are going to change which is why I personally have been on the timeline I have with this car. I dont really know what im going to do with myself when I get the car the way I want it lol scary to even think of all the spare time I will have to do things with family and friends. I appreciate what you've done with your cars Ricardoe they are an inspiration to alot of us my friend!
 
Yeah Kind of but if you work at it like I do not really. I dont use any of my income on this car Ricardoa. I only use bonus money expense money etc. I realize how blessed I am and thank God for it everyday. I could have easily just went out and bought a black on black GT500 or super snake but here I am building MY 25 year old car right along with the rest of you. I was in the same place alot of you were back in 2002 or so when I bought my first sc I could barely afford to put 93 octane in it but I loved that car and it is why this car exists. As my girls get older I know life's priorities are going to change which is why I personally have been on the timeline I have with this car. I dont really know what im going to do with myself when I get the car the way I want it lol scary to even think of all the spare time I will have to do things with family and friends. I appreciate what you've done with your cars Ricardoe they are an inspiration to alot of us my friend!

Yeah I guess the time line has passed for me but somehow We all need to keep wrenching it seems. This was my goal to finish the blue car and the mustang before the baby arrival. So I can just enjoy and not think too much about wanting to go faster set expectations right and spend time with my kids and my new family. all in all I feel blessed myself but other times I fall into the give me a break life.

Just put the kids down to sleep time to go measure drive line angles last night was alarm ripping. And I wish I had done it sooner the starter sounds more powerful and have not experienced, after 10 cranks, the dreaded click of the solenoid but no engagement of the starter. Been chasing for a solution to that for years, I hope I never have starting problems ever again.
 
Yeah I guess the time line has passed for me but somehow We all need to keep wrenching it seems. This was my goal to finish the blue car and the mustang before the baby arrival. So I can just enjoy and not think too much about wanting to go faster set expectations right and spend time with my kids and my new family. all in all I feel blessed myself but other times I fall into the give me a break life.

Just put the kids down to sleep time to go measure drive line angles last night was alarm ripping. And I wish I had done it sooner the starter sounds more powerful and have not experienced, after 10 cranks, the dreaded click of the solenoid but no engagement of the starter. Been chasing for a solution to that for years, I hope I never have starting problems ever again.

That's awesome! I generally do 90% off the stuff i do once my girls are all to bed as well that way its quiet and I'm not taking time for my stuff away from them. tonight's task is wiring the n2mb box then test it tomorrow lol
 
Took some McGuire's interior cleaner over yesterday to see if that did anything to the sticky bags :p and the answer is no. It's almost like a glazed donut feel and texture on the 2 spares I have.

Sorry boss.

-Tim
 
Thats ok I have bigger problems now.

I was trying to fix the vibes by doing all this drivetrain angle junk and one of the shaft was vibrating baddly. I spent all day between kids and working remotely or pretending to work for my job. Put a better axle shaft and the vibes are still there, so carrier side bearings might be shot. I dont have a spare, the annie one is in pieces and its a 2.73 this was my only 3.27 and the 3.08 is also in pieces I also ran out of time three full days of work ahead. So the trip is now in jeapordy. Its not meant to be. I could drive if i keep it under 60 but that wont fix me when I arrive no parts and this shaft will probably get damaged aswell. Im tapped out, going to sleep it the sore off.
 
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Thats ok I have bigger problems now.

I was trying to fix the vibes by doing all this drivetrain angle junk and one of the shaft was vibrating baddly. I spent all day between kids and working remotely or pretending to work for my job. Put a better axle shaft and the vibes are still there, so carrier side bearings might be shot. I dont have a spare, the annie one is in pieces and its a 2.73 this was my only 3.27 and the 3.08 is also in pieces I also ran out of time three full days of work ahead. So the trip is now in jeapordy. Its not meant to be. I could drive if i keep it under 60 but that wont fix me when I arrive no parts and this shaft will probably get damaged aswell. Im tapped out, going to sleep it the sore off.
all you have to do is remove the ring gear from the anny dif and blue. use the center section with th the ring gear out of the blue car.
 
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