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Thread: Derek's Project GFP

  1. #106
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Bossier City, LA
    Posts
    2,238
    Look at your 89 tach; I don't think it HAS the CYL pin.

    But for 1991+ tachs, not in SCs, yes, you ground the CYL pin.

    What you might need to do, to keep the SC tach, is pickup a tach adapter, like this one (note: picked as a representative part, is NOT a recommendation for this unit!): http://www.allzim.com/store/tach-ada...e-adapter.html

    RwP

  2. #107
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by RalphP View Post
    Look at your 89 tach; I don't think it HAS the CYL pin.

    But for 1991+ tachs, not in SCs, yes, you ground the CYL pin.

    What you might need to do, to keep the SC tach, is pickup a tach adapter, like this one (note: picked as a representative part, is NOT a recommendation for this unit!): http://www.allzim.com/store/tach-ada...e-adapter.html

    RwP
    I already have this 92 lx tach. I just wanted to verify that if I tied the two pins I had circled, that it would make it an 8 cylinder tach.
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  3. #108
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    Swapped out the tach out in the cluster tonight and took some pictures. I removed the original tach from the cluster and compared it to the new tach from a v6-v8 lx bird. Right away you can see the difference... the v6 v8 tach has an extra pin labeled CYL. My understanding is that you ground this pin to make the tach work in v8 mode. The 89 SC cluster has no connection for this pin, so you just ground the pin with a jumper on the back of the board. I trimmed the CYL pin down to make sure it didnt interfere (not sure if that is required or not, but I did it anyways). I also took a few minutes to swap the gauge face and the needle over. My needle was in better shape and the SC gauge face says Premium Unleaded Fuel Only instead of the v6-v8 tach that says Unleaded Fuel Only.

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    Ive got some work to do before I can start the car again and test it out to see if it works. But from what Ive read and now seeing the difference, it all makes sense.
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  4. #109
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Greenville, IN
    Posts
    4,404
    Do you have the EVTM? Should be able to tell for sure and easily if grounding the pin is all that's needed with it.
    Matt Haub
    Shootouts: '09 SS 1st | '10 Mod1 2nd | '11 Bracket 3rd | '12 Bracket 1st | 2013 | '14 Bracket 3rd | 2015 | '16 Bracket 1st & Mod2 2nd | 2017 |
    Black '89 5spd - 281K miles, MPx, E85, Alky-Inj ¶ RWHP: ? RWTQ: ? ¶ Best 1/4mi:12.521, MPH:107.23mph
    35th Anniversary Auto 46k miles | Red '93 Auto 186k miles
    My Garage

  5. #110
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by DrFishbone View Post
    Do you have the EVTM? Should be able to tell for sure and easily if grounding the pin is all that's needed with it.
    Correction, it appears that the 92 EVTM shows that the "sport cluster" shows a circuit 875 coming from the tach going to ground. on that circuit there is a note that says "5.0L Engine Only". The performance cluster does not have this, and the electronic cluster is so complicated, i didnt look that close.

    I thought the EEC told the tach what engine was in the car, but I guess im wrong. It appears that its the harness.
    Last edited by dthompson; 08-15-2018 at 06:12 PM.
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  6. #111
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    Down pipe is made! Its a tight fit... 3" off the turbine housing, immediately transitioned to 3.5". Its tight enough that I have to take the exhaust manifold off in order to install it. I massaged a couple places to improve clearances, but nothing major. Apparently I had ordered an extra wide band bung a long time ago... cause i found one in the tool box! Its a long one that keeps the sensor out of the direct stream.

    I wish I would have bought mild steel u bends instead of this aluminized stuff. it really is a pain to grind off the coating. You can see the crap you miss floating up as you weld. I also added a brace to the bottom of the down pipe coming off the bottom of the bell housing. I still need to decide if im going to plumb the WG back into the down pipe. Once everything is all finished up, I will wrap it in heat wrap.

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    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  7. #112
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    I decided to break the remaining exhaust into two pieces to make life a little easier. Its made so that a resonator can be added if needed in the future. I had intended on documenting the fuel line upgrade, but you can pretty much see what is going on with that in the second picture.

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    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  8. #113
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Woodbridge, VA
    Posts
    5,174
    Looks sweet! Nice job!
    ~Chris
    SCCoA Member #1826
    Bettie Riding jack stands
    SCARlit on drag duty now

  9. #114
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by BLOWN38 View Post
    Looks sweet! Nice job!
    Thanks Chris! Im ready to hear it with the exhaust on there... maybe in a couple weekends.
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  10. #115
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    I pretty much finished up the exhaust work. Now to check out that rear main seal that appears to be leaking... ughh. I hope i can get that fixed tomorrow and get this thing running on Labor day.

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    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  11. #116
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    the good, bad, and the ugly...

    so, the rear main seal appeared to be leaking... along with the oil pan. In order to replace the oil pan gasket, i had to pull the motor... so out came the gas tank, drive shaft, trans, clutch flywheel, exhaust manifold, down pipe, turbo, upper intake, drain the coolant, drain the oil... sucks but not so bad yet.

    So the motor is on the stand, and I take the pan off. ~~~... there is trash all in the bottom of the pan. so i pull the rear main cap off and see the bearing is not real happy. it only has 10 mins of run time on it (if that). so i check another main and it is simliar, but not as bad. pull three rod caps and they are similar to not as bad. one was perfect. and yeah, the crap in the pan was metal, it stuck to the magnetic plugs. The bearing wear appears to mostly be the coating, nothing that your fingernail would catch on... but im not sure that matters.

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    Anyways... here i sit, beer in hand, contemplating what to do... Part of me wants to send it. The other part of me wants to send it to the machine shop. either way its $350 worth of seals, bearings and gaskets in the trash. The risk is trashing the turbo, is about the same price... a little more. i suspect that for 1K i could straighten out what i got. for 2k i could straighten out an add some forged rods and pistons. and for 3k i could build a forged 408/427.

    the dilemma as i see it is that 1k is still a stock rebuild junkyard motor, 2k is still a 351 when it doesnt cost that much more to build a 408/427, and 3k needs 2k worth of heads and cam (nobody in their right mind would put an e7 on a 408).

    rods and pistons is probably the way to go, in order to reach 700whp. but it will still take a set of heads to get there. so why not 408???
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  12. #117
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    well for better or worse, im gonna slap it back together and run it as is.
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  13. #118
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Roanoke, Virginia
    Posts
    3,294
    I think you'll be fine...looks like the bearings had a little dry start thus the wear. If you're not snagging a nail I wouldn't anticipate any more damage to occur.

    Keep up the good work. The work you've done is nothing less than super impressive!

    -Tim
    Current Collection
    1994 Thunderbird SC - Auto converted to 5spd

    1995 Thunderbird SC - Auto

    1994 Thunderbird SC - 5spd
    1989 Thunderbird SC - 5spd - Daily Driver
    1990 Thunder/Cougar XR7 - 5spd
    1994 Thunderbird SC - 3v Project

  14. #119
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Groth View Post
    I think you'll be fine...looks like the bearings had a little dry start thus the wear. If you're not snagging a nail I wouldn't anticipate any more damage to occur.

    Keep up the good work. The work you've done is nothing less than super impressive!

    -Tim
    Thanks Tim. I used a lot of assembly lube, and I primed the motor. My guess is that since I did not replace the cam bearings, there was some trash that i could not clean out well. the trash was either worse at the back of the block (im pretty sure that is the direction the oil flows to) and/or there is a line bore issue. but since its the crank that came with the block, i suspect any issue like that is probably livable. The only other thing that I can think of is the balance is not perfect. its a different balancer and flywheel than before, but they are both the 28oz imbalance for 351w so it should be fine.

    I kinda feel like you said, its probably fine. Not ideal, but probably fine.

    In hind sight, I wish i would have left this motor alone... maybe just pulling the heads to fix those valves... maybe just leaving them and living with it. Its kinda like sloppy says, "if you look at your cam bearings, they will be bad, if you dont, they will be fine". Im sure all that stuff would have been fine for what I was doing, but i just couldnt stop myself, I had to take it apart and look at it!

    If i get a year out of it (maybe 1000 miles), that will be fine. I should be able to save up some money for the next phase by that time.
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

  15. #120
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    688
    So I've got the car running now, but the power steering pump has been a battle. The pump from the previous motor had a terrible bearing noise after the swap. I replaced the pump, and the fluid still wanted to boil after a short test drive. I had deleted the cooler previously because it started leaking with the last motor. So I added a respectable sized cooler (the stock cooler is kind of a joke). I also insulated the lines to reflect any heat from the turbo kit. My last test drive seemed to be a success. Another trick I read about was to use a hand vacuum pump to draw a vacuum out the air from the system. It seems to have done the trick. Here are some pics from that work.

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    I had some initial concerns that the left and right engine banks were requiring drastically different fueling.... about 15% difference. With the power steering pump fixed, I was able to do a littler longer test drive. Its looking like the at idle the difference is 12%, but with some load on the motor its looking like 5%. I was really concerned at first because the initial evidence looked like 15% everywhere. Now I'm less concerned but there is a lot of tuning left to do, so I'll keep an eye on it. Im working the bugs out finally, and have gotten most of the oil leaks stopped (the rear main or rear of the pan is still leaking (but im not pulling the trans to work on it again until it become more than a annoyance). After this second hurricane passes through, I can get out and tune some more on the interstate next time. I find that is where I can do the best tuning, where there is reasonably flat and open space. Hopefully I can get it sorted enough to start building some boosty-boost.
    Any idiot can make a Mustang fast...
    It takes a special idiot to make a Thunderbird fast!!!
    89 SC 4.3 stroker 384rwhp 473ftlbs
    Best ET 13.085 Best MPH 106.6... got some work to do!
    2016 V6 M90 Dyno Champ 2016 Mod 1 Runner Up

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