Need help purchasing a new HB for my 95 SC...

phils89sc

Registered User
I was running my SC last night after upgrading the alternator to a 130A from another Ford. I noticed, and she has been doing this for a while now, when it was idling, it had an random misfire that would not go away.

For some reason, I was looking at the crank pulley, and although it was not wobbling at all, I noticed that when the engine would misfire, the balance ring on the HB was sliding off the hub to the front and rear of the engine, back and forth, hence causing the misfire.

I have had another SC, a 91 I think where the HB just broke completely off. I am glad I caught this early so at least nothing else is damaged.

I have gone through the posts and have found one that listed a Dayco (Powerbond) balance, #PB1530N. The problem with this one is with the exciter ring for the CP sensor is incorrect. Can just the exciter ring be swapped for the one off my existing balancer? I liked the fact that this Dayco balancer was all cast iron and not aluminum hub, iron balance ring, like the factory junk.

I also found this one from Rock Auto, #ATP 102020 by ATP. It has the correct exciter ring, but I am pretty sure has an aluminum hub, which I am not thrilled with at all.

Right now, I need to get my car on the road and cannot even thing about a BHJ, as great as they sound, even the billet one, they are ridiculously priced, especially through SCP.

Any help you can give is greatly appreciated!
 
I never heard of a exciter ring problem with Dayco balancers, is it only a problem for 94/95 engine's?
 
I never heard of a exciter ring problem with Dayco balancers, is it only a problem for 94/95 engine's?

Pretty sure he is talking about Dayco/Powerbond only making early model 89-93 balancer that has a different style crank sensor and exciter ring. I've head that this early model balancer can be reworked to fit a late model SC motor but don't recall what all needs to be done to it.

I think David Dalke has done the rework.

David
 
Thank you all for your help!

I ended up buying the ATP one from RockAuto. Anything is better that the one I had!
 
You might want to investigate the correctness of this HB for the 95 SC.

I agree the exciter ring looks right, but the balancer portion looks to be counterbalanced and not neutral balance. Rock Auto description also calls out California, which I believe has the 3.8 normally aspirated motor.

On many part supplier websites, selecting the R code during the vehicle selection process doesn't ensure the correct parts are shown. I think this is the case with Rockauto with respect to haronic balancers. If you select the 3.8 NA option in Rockauto, you'll see the same part numbers are called out for the HB's... They shouldn't be the same part number between NA and SC.

Have you installed in on your car?

I understand your wanting a more economical solution, so here might be something to investigate.

Dayco offers PB1530N for the 1993 and earlier SC, but it has the wrong exciter ring attached. Will the exciter ring from your HB fit? Who knows?.. If so this would be an economical solution as it is neutral balanced.

Dayco also offers PB1538N which appears similar to your 95 SC, but it is for a 4.2 V6 Ford F150. The exciter ring looks similar, but maybe your exciter ring could be substituted to ensure accurate timing. The hub portion of the balancer looks dimensionally similar to PB1530N.


FYI... One of the mounting holes for the exciter ring on PB1538N is slightly offset (ie: not 90 degrees apart like the other 3), so the exciter ring is positioned correctly with respect to keyway. Not certain if this is true on the stock exciter ring.
 
You might want to investigate the correctness of this HB for the 95 SC.

I agree the exciter ring looks right, but the balancer portion looks to be counterbalanced and not neutral balance. Rock Auto description also calls out California, which I believe has the 3.8 normally aspirated motor.

On many part supplier websites, selecting the R code during the vehicle selection process doesn't ensure the correct parts are shown. I think this is the case with Rockauto with respect to haronic balancers. If you select the 3.8 NA option in Rockauto, you'll see the same part numbers are called out for the HB's... They shouldn't be the same part number between NA and SC.

Have you installed in on your car?

I understand your wanting a more economical solution, so here might be something to investigate.

Dayco offers PB1530N for the 1993 and earlier SC, but it has the wrong exciter ring attached. Will the exciter ring from your HB fit? Who knows?.. If so this would be an economical solution as it is neutral balanced.

Dayco also offers PB1538N which appears similar to your 95 SC, but it is for a 4.2 V6 Ford F150. The exciter ring looks similar, but maybe your exciter ring could be substituted to ensure accurate timing. The hub portion of the balancer looks dimensionally similar to PB1530N.


FYI... One of the mounting holes for the exciter ring on PB1538N is slightly offset (ie: not 90 degrees apart like the other 3), so the exciter ring is positioned correctly with respect to keyway. Not certain if this is true on the stock exciter ring.

Thanks for the reply. I have not installed it yet, but it does look identical to to the original. It will be a while before I get it installed because I am pulling the engine and transmission in order to reseal the engine and transmission. I will look at these other balancers though because I would like to have a spare.

I will try to post some pics side by side with new and original balancers.

Thanks again!
 
Ditto. Its not like we drive these cars very much anymore anyway. That hub will last longer than you'll want the car.. :D

Well, my current daily driver is my 06 Mustang GT, manual. She is lowered and fun to drive, but not doing me any favors in the ride quality department! I know the SC's ride well, and mine needs some suspension upkeep, and rocker rust repair, but I plan on driving her ALOT, so she has to be dependable. Last time I broke a balancer, I didn't have the good fortune of the hub no breaking off... At least this time it is just the balancer ring sliding loose and the hub not snapping off! That job really just sucks!!
 
So based on the Ford part number listed on Rock Auto - that balancer is for the NA 3.8 engine and not the SC engine

https://parts.lakelandford.com/p/Fo...ne-Crankshaft-Pulley/60540748/F4DZ6B321A.html

To my understanding BHJ is the only option for the SC engine when it comes to the 94/95 engine. Also there is a used one offered on tbirdscshop for $269.xx - certainly not cheap but less than new. Here's the link if it's any help to you.

https://www.tbscshop.com/bhj-harmonic-balancer-1994-1995-thunderbird-sc-grade-a/


-Tim
 
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So based on the Ford part number listed on Rock Auto - that balancer is for the NA 3.8 engine and not the SC engine

https://parts.lakelandford.com/p/Fo...ne-Crankshaft-Pulley/60540748/F4DZ6B321A.html

To my understanding BHJ is the only option for the SC engine when it comes to the 94/95 engine. Also there is a used one offered on tbirdscshop for $269.xx - certainly not cheap but less than new. Here's the link if it's any help to you.

https://www.tbscshop.com/bhj-harmonic-balancer-1994-1995-thunderbird-sc-grade-a/


-Tim

Well, this sucks... Thanks for the help with that Tim!

After putting them side by side, the ATP102020 from Rock Auto is NOT the correct part... and is indeed couter-weighted and NOT a zero balance unit. Here are some pics...

IMG_1016.JPG

IMG_1015.JPG

I don't think I want to spend money on a used one... Dang...this sucks.. I knew it was just too good to be true..too easy!

Is there anyone out there that can fix harmonic balancers?

Thanks for the info Tim.
 
It looks like damperdoctor.com can actually rebuild HB's. Has anyone ever used them for this service?

Thanks

A used BHJ would be fine they're made of steel and not aluminum so you do not have to worry about stretching. Personally I'd trust a used BHJ more so than a rebuilt factory unit. All of my SCs have BHJs...expensive but I also had the hub snap off on the crank before. Money is worth the piece of mind.

-Tim
 
A used BHJ would be fine they're made of steel and not aluminum so you do not have to worry about stretching. Personally I'd trust a used BHJ more so than a rebuilt factory unit. All of my SCs have BHJs...expensive but I also had the hub snap off on the crank before. Money is worth the piece of mind.

-Tim

I fully agree Tim, but they say they are currently out of stock for that link. I am not sure what to do to be honest... I surely cannot afford a brand new BHJ balancer.
 
A used BHJ would be fine they're made of steel and not aluminum so you do not have to worry about stretching. Personally I'd trust a used BHJ more so than a rebuilt factory unit. All of my SCs have BHJs...expensive but I also had the hub snap off on the crank before. Money is worth the piece of mind.

-Tim

I don't suppose the HB from a 1998 F-150 4.2L would work on our 94-95 SC's would it? It is all cast iron and could not the crank sensor ring be transferred from the SC balancer?

Thoughts? These are also internally balanced engines, like the 94-95 SC 3.8L

Sorry, I just don't have the $500 for the BHJ...

2020-05-13 22_42_11-Window.jpg2020-05-13 22_42_31-Window.jpg
 
I have a new Dayco PB1985N (4.2L neutral balance for a Freestar) on the shelf that I bought from Rock Auto last year as well as an early model stock SC damper. I don't know if the crank trigger ring on the early model SC is the same as the 94-95 version but I will have a look this evening to see what it might entail to swap it over.
 
I had a few minutes tonight to look at those dampers but not enough time to dive in deep with it. The 94-95 sensor ring is different after all but it appears to be almost identical to the one the new damper came with. I found a picture of a 94-95 one on TBSC Shop and compared it to the new dampers ring. Visually it looks almost the same and has the same number of teeth but without having one to measure I don't know.

This isn't really relevant anymore for your search after learning that the rings are different but for those out there that have an 89-93 and are dropping a neutral balance engine into it I think that if you use the ring from the 89-93 and then bore it out 4mm, re-drill the bolt holes (make sure that the vanes line up in the correct location before drilling) and flip it upside down it will fit on that Powerbond damper that I bought. I have not tested this in a vehicle and some adjusting may be required.






If anybody has a crank ring off of 94-95 and a few minutes to measure a few places on it I can find out if the ring is a match or not dimension wise.
 
I had a few minutes tonight to look at those dampers but not enough time to dive in deep with it. The 94-95 sensor ring is different after all but it appears to be almost identical to the one the new damper came with. I found a picture of a 94-95 one on TBSC Shop and compared it to the new dampers ring. Visually it looks almost the same and has the same number of teeth but without having one to measure I don't know.

This isn't really relevant anymore for your search after learning that the rings are different but for those out there that have an 89-93 and are dropping a neutral balance engine into it I think that if you use the ring from the 89-93 and then bore it out 4mm, re-drill the bolt holes (make sure that the vanes line up in the correct location before drilling) and flip it upside down it will fit on that Powerbond damper that I bought. I have not tested this in a vehicle and some adjusting may be required.






If anybody has a crank ring off of 94-95 and a few minutes to measure a few places on it I can find out if the ring is a match or not dimension wise.


Thank you for the pics! That does help!

What is the hub material on the PB1985N balancer? Iron, steel or aluminum?
 
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