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Thread: Need help purchasing a new HB for my 95 SC...

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Rock Hill, SC
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    842
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Groth View Post
    A used BHJ would be fine they're made of steel and not aluminum so you do not have to worry about stretching. Personally I'd trust a used BHJ more so than a rebuilt factory unit. All of my SCs have BHJs...expensive but I also had the hub snap off on the crank before. Money is worth the piece of mind.

    -Tim
    I don't suppose the HB from a 1998 F-150 4.2L would work on our 94-95 SC's would it? It is all cast iron and could not the crank sensor ring be transferred from the SC balancer?

    Thoughts? These are also internally balanced engines, like the 94-95 SC 3.8L

    Sorry, I just don't have the $500 for the BHJ...

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  2. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    Nova Scotia, Canada
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    125
    I have a new Dayco PB1985N (4.2L neutral balance for a Freestar) on the shelf that I bought from Rock Auto last year as well as an early model stock SC damper. I don't know if the crank trigger ring on the early model SC is the same as the 94-95 version but I will have a look this evening to see what it might entail to swap it over.

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    Nova Scotia, Canada
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    I had a few minutes tonight to look at those dampers but not enough time to dive in deep with it. The 94-95 sensor ring is different after all but it appears to be almost identical to the one the new damper came with. I found a picture of a 94-95 one on TBSC Shop and compared it to the new dampers ring. Visually it looks almost the same and has the same number of teeth but without having one to measure I don't know.

    This isn't really relevant anymore for your search after learning that the rings are different but for those out there that have an 89-93 and are dropping a neutral balance engine into it I think that if you use the ring from the 89-93 and then bore it out 4mm, re-drill the bolt holes (make sure that the vanes line up in the correct location before drilling) and flip it upside down it will fit on that Powerbond damper that I bought. I have not tested this in a vehicle and some adjusting may be required.






    If anybody has a crank ring off of 94-95 and a few minutes to measure a few places on it I can find out if the ring is a match or not dimension wise.

  4. #19
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    Aug 2002
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    Quote Originally Posted by jb351 View Post
    I had a few minutes tonight to look at those dampers but not enough time to dive in deep with it. The 94-95 sensor ring is different after all but it appears to be almost identical to the one the new damper came with. I found a picture of a 94-95 one on TBSC Shop and compared it to the new dampers ring. Visually it looks almost the same and has the same number of teeth but without having one to measure I don't know.

    This isn't really relevant anymore for your search after learning that the rings are different but for those out there that have an 89-93 and are dropping a neutral balance engine into it I think that if you use the ring from the 89-93 and then bore it out 4mm, re-drill the bolt holes (make sure that the vanes line up in the correct location before drilling) and flip it upside down it will fit on that Powerbond damper that I bought. I have not tested this in a vehicle and some adjusting may be required.






    If anybody has a crank ring off of 94-95 and a few minutes to measure a few places on it I can find out if the ring is a match or not dimension wise.

    Thank you for the pics! That does help!

    What is the hub material on the PB1985N balancer? Iron, steel or aluminum?

  5. #20
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    Oct 2018
    Location
    Nova Scotia, Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by phils89sc View Post
    Thank you for the pics! That does help!

    What is the hub material on the PB1985N balancer? Iron, steel or aluminum?
    The material is iron. Dayco calls it Spheroidal Graphite iron casting which is just another term for ductile iron. It is stronger than aluminum, stronger than regular iron but not quite as strong as steel.

    Rock Auto info page

    Dayco info page

  6. #21
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    Aug 2002
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    Quote Originally Posted by jb351 View Post
    The material is iron. Dayco calls it Spheroidal Graphite iron casting which is just another term for ductile iron. It is stronger than aluminum, stronger than regular iron but not quite as strong as steel.

    Rock Auto info page

    Dayco info page
    Thanks for the info again man... I think that is the one I am going to go for. The Dorman one from the 98 F-150 4.2L can probably be used as well as long as the crank sensor ring can be transferred over from the old SC balancer to the new one. Downside to Dorman is that the HB hub is aluminum and not iron. It would likely work for a while...but.. we all know how that combo of aluminum hub and steel / iron ring work out.

    One other thing.. What is the tooth count for the crankshaft ring on the PB1585N balancer?

    Thanks again!

  7. #22
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    Oct 2018
    Location
    Nova Scotia, Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by phils89sc View Post

    One other thing.. What is the tooth count for the crankshaft ring on the PB1585N balancer?

    Thanks again!
    The tooth count on that ring is 35 teeth.

    You're welcome. If you need any more measurements/photos or whatever it will be on my shelf for some time yet.
    Last edited by jb351; 05-15-2020 at 10:31 AM.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    842
    I decided to order go ahead and order DAYCO PB1585N from RockAuto. This balancer is from a 2004 Ford Freestar with the 4.2L. On RockAuto's site, it stated that the balancer material is a ductile iron construction. It is also for an internally balanced engine, having no counterweight.

    Here are some pictures to compare the PB1585N to the original 94-95 SC balancer. I verified that it is indeed all ductile iron and it appears to be much more substantial in quality than the factory junk harmonic balancer. So, I will be installing this when I get my motor put back together. Even the crankshaft sensor ring is the same as the 94-95 SC!

    If this works, this would give us a 94-95 SC's a more inexpensive alternative to the BHJ balancers. I am in no way knocking the quality of the BHJ's, but for those of use who cannot justify the cost of them ($500-ish new), this $100 HB made of all iron instead of the garbage aluminum hub of Ford design.

    Please let me know what you all think. Much thanks to all for your posts and suggestions!!
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  9. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Salem OR
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    interesting - looks like you nailed it.

    I keep wondering what parts on my 2002 Windstar besides the oil filter I can use on my SC

    Might be the iron will add a bit more smoothness to the engine, not that there is a lot now.

    Good luck w/it.

  10. #25
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    Aug 2002
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    Yes sir! I have high hopes for this! IT was $89 plus shipping from RockAuto!
    I appreciate all of your help here!

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    470
    Good morning


    Is there a height difference between the original balancer/pulley combination vs dayco harmonic balancer? Most likely an optical illusion in the first picture. The "boss" pulley mount height of the original balancer looks a little taller vs the dayco. Might affect the accessory/jackshaft 8 rib belt alignment.

  12. #27
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    Oct 2018
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    Nova Scotia, Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by phils89sc View Post
    Yes sir! I have high hopes for this! IT was $89 plus shipping from RockAuto!
    I appreciate all of your help here!
    Hope it works out. Keep us posted.

  13. #28
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    Aug 2002
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam jones View Post
    Good morning


    Is there a height difference between the original balancer/pulley combination vs dayco harmonic balancer? Most likely an optical illusion in the first picture. The "boss" pulley mount height of the original balancer looks a little taller vs the dayco. Might affect the accessory/jackshaft 8 rib belt alignment.
    That is an optical illusion due to camera angle. I think what makes it appear taller is the actual thickness of the balance ring on the Dayco balancer is substantially "thicker" than the one on the SC balancer. When placed side by side on a flat surface, and a measured, they are equal height. I did a quick fit of my stock main pulley and it seems to fit fine.

    I hope this helps!

  14. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
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    20
    So the information I gave you back in post #6 was correct after all.

    Good luck!

  15. #30
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    Apr 2002
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    St. Charles, MO
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    21,119
    Looks like the only thing you will need to do is re-drill the one offset bolt hole on your crank pulley with a larger hole so it will fit the symmetrical bolt pattern on the new balancer. See circled hole on stock balancer picture, it is the one that is slightly offset to insure timing marks on the crank pulley line up.


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