4.6L SOHC Engine swap to 1995 5spd SC

SR71BLACKBIRD

Registered User
I am needing to replace the motor in a 1995 SC 5spd and am looking at going with a 4.6L Crate motor. And will probably drop a Supercharger on it.
Wouldn't be an SC without one would it?

I am not sure what all this will entail.

Radiator? Tranny? K-Member? Wiring harness? etc....

Does anybody have any advice to give to a new SC guy?

ANY! Help would be greatly appreciated.
And the best advice will win a Half Rack of their favorite beverage.

Thanks in advance,
Jim
 
Dont do it man. 95 5speed sc's are the rarest ones to come by. You would be messing it up by doing an engine swap. Whats wrong with the engine?
 
SR71BLACKBIRD said:
I am needing to replace the motor in a 1995 SC 5spd and am looking at going with a 4.6L Crate motor. And will probably drop a Supercharger on it.
Wouldn't be an SC without one would it?

I am not sure what all this will entail.

Radiator? Tranny? K-Member? Wiring harness? etc....

Does anybody have any advice to give to a new SC guy?

ANY! Help would be greatly appreciated.
And the best advice will win a Half Rack of their favorite beverage.

Thanks in advance,
Jim

Your 5 speed will not bolt to a 4.6.
 
Good luck bud, you'll have to change the transmission too. There are a lot of wiring differences between the SC and LX so you'll need to be savey on that too. There's a guy with a sweet 4.6 with a Vortech and 5spd that I've seen run. It's almost as fast as my V6. :) Definititely sounds very cool.

My point is the V6 can be just as fast up to a point for less/same money. Of course if you are planning on 600rwhp then the V8 is the way to go but it will still cost a small fortune. :)
 
As others have already said, don't do it. 95 SC's are rare enough, not to mention 5-speed 95's.

But, if you have any specific questions on the swap, send me an email at rodsv6cougar@cs.com, and I'll do my best to answer them. I swapped a 4.6L DOHC into a 90 XR7 awhile back.

-Rod
 
If you wanting to build a 4.6 with supercharger.
I would start with a 2003 or 04 Cobra.Buy a complete
Cobra from a junkyard.Then you would have most
every part needed.Should be able to get one for
around $10,000.00

www.junkyarddog.com
 
A 4.6L with a supercharger to replace the 3.8L with supercharger. Hmmm....to be honest, it would simply be a novelty. You would get a cool V8 rumble too, but that would be it. No matter what brand blower you went with, you would be somewhat boost limited on the motor because you would have weaker cast pistons and crank. Therefore, the most you could really hope for is 300ish RWHP. And for that kind of power, you would be spending a LOT of cash. Even if the motor were free you would have to buy the supercharger kit?

Or you could spend the doe on a supercharger for the 4.6L for an AutoRotor for the 3.8L and be at the same HP level with a lot less headache (getting the motor in there, getting the wiring straightened out, adapting a 5 speed tranny, etc....

If you are bent on a 4.6L, I would just buy a 4.6L and make that your platform. It would be easier to swap ground effects and a T45 than to go the route you are explaining.

Micah
 
94 V8 swap

Thanks for all the advice.

First off I wanted to make a correction, it's actually a 1994, not that it matters much I suppose but I know how car guys are about technical stuff.

This is a great technical forum.
You guys know more about these rides than 99% of the mechanics out there.

I talked with Denny Aldridge of Aldridge Motorsports and he pretty much told me the same stuff.
But he sold me when he said he could get me 350-400RWHP and keep the 3.8L platform. Which I am sure will be worth more down the road.

I still have a goal of building a 600+RWHP Vette eater but I will probably take some of your advice and start with a 4.6L LX platform. Alot of advantages there that I saw once the smoke from burning tires cleared from my vision.

1 It will be alot easier to swap Trannys than motors.
2 The project car will be much cheaper.
3 If I convert an LX, no one will give a rats ***.
4 If I reduce it to a smoldering pile of crap wreckage, no great loss.

Although I'm not thrilled about dropping several Grand I can't wait to drive it.

Thanks again everybody,
Lets talk shop again soon.
Jim
 
yep. you would want to go with a 4.6L DOHC 32 VALVE. Thats the only way to go. Either that or a 5.0. I would preferablly drop in a 5.0L CAMMER ENGINE. Oh yeah baby! But its you man. I dont think there are many aftermarket parts for the SOHC 4.6L. And if they are i hear they suck!
 
First off...if your homie can pull 350-400RWHP out of an SC...definitely keep us updated. I don't recall ever hearing that name around the SC community, so if he's going his own direction for go fast goodies it would be very good for us to learn about what he's doing. It's taken us well over 6 years now to consistantly get into the 350-400RWHP range and it was no walk in the park.

Second....I'm not so sure I would go with a 32 valve 4.6L. In fact, I know that I definitely would NOT go with one. I'm really sold on the SOHC explorer motor. They are cheap....like under a grand. Plus they have the 70lb lighter aluminum block with cross bolt mains (effectively the 6 bolt main cobra block) with PI heads. The motors are generally cheaper, more compact and keeps the stock look in a 96-97 T-Bird LX. I've got visions of assembling an Explorer motor with more aggressive cams, some mild porting, flat black underdrives, chip, gears, etc.... having a 13 second screamer that doesn't look modified.

Micah
 
Thanks Dude,

Thanks for helping out Dogg,
It may be a few weeks before the work is complete and I can pay for it but I am sure I will be letting everyone here know all about it. Like who else is gonna care right? Other than a jealous Bowtie enthusiast who won't believe me anyway! ;)

Blackbird

Micahdogg said:
First off...if your homie can pull 350-400RWHP out of an SC...definitely keep us updated. I don't recall ever hearing that name around the SC community, so if he's going his own direction for go fast goodies it would be very good for us to learn about what he's doing. It's taken us well over 6 years now to consistantly get into the 350-400RWHP range and it was no walk in the park.

Second....I'm not so sure I would go with a 32 valve 4.6L. In fact, I know that I definitely would NOT go with one. I'm really sold on the SOHC explorer motor. They are cheap....like under a grand. Plus they have the 70lb lighter aluminum block with cross bolt mains (effectively the 6 bolt main cobra block) with PI heads. The motors are generally cheaper, more compact and keeps the stock look in a 96-97 T-Bird LX. I've got visions of assembling an Explorer motor with more aggressive cams, some mild porting, flat black underdrives, chip, gears, etc.... having a 13 second screamer that doesn't look modified.

Micah
 
Micahdogg said:
Second....I'm not so sure I would go with a 32 valve 4.6L. In fact, I know that I definitely would NOT go with one. I'm really sold on the SOHC explorer motor. They are cheap....like under a grand. Plus they have the 70lb lighter aluminum block with cross bolt mains (effectively the 6 bolt main cobra block) with PI heads. The motors are generally cheaper, more compact and keeps the stock look in a 96-97 T-Bird LX. I've got visions of assembling an Explorer motor with more aggressive cams, some mild porting, flat black underdrives, chip, gears, etc.... having a 13 second screamer that doesn't look modified.

Micah

Yeah, but the DOHC 4.6's can look soooo good in a MN12:

showcar%20engine.jpg


When they aren't all dusty, that is. :)

Plus, the pre 03 DOHC's have the aluminum 6-bolt main block, too.

-Rod
 
Motor Swap-SC vs. LX 'Bird

Hey Bud,
Would have to agree with a lot of the comments already posted.
If you want a V8, start with an LX that already has one. There are still a lot of "birds out there with under 150K, and they are fairly cheap. You can search for specific years on autotrader.com with a nationwide search. You will also find SC's on here in the 100-180K(miles) range for under 5 Grand.
Realize first of all, its going to be heavier, and with the limitations of stock crank and pistons in the 4.6, you don't want to stress it too much. That's why it was mentioned to go with a junkyard Cobra engine. All the good internals are already there, and you need that to even consider putting a blower on it. You will need the trans also, and a BIG shoehorn, to put this in an SC! It can be done, but is a lot of work, and pretty involved! Start with an LX first. But then you won't have all the goodies the SC comes with. Incidentally, yes, the '95 5-speed is more rare than the '94 5-speed, the production numbers are higher for the '94.
Honestly, your best bet is to just pull out your 3.8 V6, crate it up and send it off to Coy Miller for either a Stage I or Stage II Rebuild. He has many very satisfied customers here in SC-land, and when you stack it all up (including all the labor) the prices are actually very reasonable! The main thing is that YOU WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED! That in itself is priceless. You will also have a fresh SC that retains its "stock" configuration, thereby actually making it worth more! Figure it out on paper... you will actually be saving money, as opposed to swapping out with an 8.......and weight.:)
 
It's been my experience that the LX 4.6L birds are almost always lighter than an SC. Even if the motor is heavier (which I doubt), the entire car is easily 150-200lbs lighter on average. A friends 95 4.6L weighed in just over 3700 when checking the scales at the track. On a good day mine is over 3900.

Also, Coy Miller would not be the best option. That would be a $7500 option that would turn to $10,000 after cost of crating, shipping to VA and buying supporting pieces for the engine that don't come with the build up like injectors, fuel pump, exhaust, MAF, TB, and it would be backwards to not upgrade the blower to something better than a run of the mill stock M-90.

For $3500 you could get the AR and with absolutely nothing but exhaust be putting 280-290 RWHP down. Of course 300 is just a fuel pump, injectors and C&L meter away.

Micah
 
Micahdogg said:
It's been my experience that the LX 4.6L birds are almost always lighter than an SC. Even if the motor is heavier (which I doubt), the entire car is easily 150-200lbs lighter on average. A friends 95 4.6L weighed in just over 3700 when checking the scales at the track. On a good day mine is over 3900.

Also, Coy Miller would not be the best option. That would be a $7500 option that would turn to $10,000 after cost of crating, shipping to VA and buying supporting pieces for the engine that don't come with the build up like injectors, fuel pump, exhaust, MAF, TB, and it would be backwards to not upgrade the blower to something better than a run of the mill stock M-90.

For $3500 you could get the AR and with absolutely nothing but exhaust be putting 280-290 RWHP down. Of course 300 is just a fuel pump, injectors and C&L meter away.

Micah

The AR is not just a simple bolt on either. You have to have a better IC, larger fuel pump, larger injectors, different MAF. $3500 simply won't get the AR on your car. Closer to $5k to get it on with all the supporting parts if you're going from a stock car. I know, because I'm doing it right now. I'm getting my SC all set up for the AR. But the AR is the cheaper and faster way to go to get to over 300 rwhp. With a built car (heads and cam) you'll be looking at closer to 400 rwhp, but a lot more money.
 
Not true. All you NEED for the AR is $3200 (last price I saw) and $200 in exhaust work. That'll get you over 270RWHP. Dalke was getting 296RWHP with just an intercooler beyond that.

So that tells me with a C&L 73mm MAF with 42# tube for $180 tops, set of 8 42# injectors new for $250 to your door and a 255 fuel pump for $130 you could clear 300RWHP...through a paper filter and on stock IC. And if you hit the rollers (usually $75 for 3 pulls) you would have gotten a tune to seal the 300RW deal.

But yes, the AR will work on 100% stock everything....and if you open up the exhaust it should support 270RWHP with no other mods.

Even if you supercharged a 4.6L and ran with the 6# pulley (typically used on a stock 4.6L with mileage) you would be lucky to be over 270RWHP.

Micah

P.S. Last I checked, when you sign up for a Coy Stage II, Coy will strongly suggest you upgrade the other parts like I mentioned before. Even with that stuff he was getting 440HP at the crank. His motors typically ran 300RWHP with these parts in place. If you want nothing other than his $7500 motor you power would only be increasing from heads/cam (the roller rockers and titanium valvetrain would wash from the increased friction of a fresh rebuild IMO). YOu don't need a built race engine for that. And quite frankly, just his heads and cam on a stock everything else motor would be LUCKY to break 250RWHP. For $7500.

Compare that to an AR with stock everthing for half the price and you'll blow 250RW out of the water.
 
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Swap is off

Although the AR setup will be something I need to do in the future.
The original reason behind doing this was because I have a Rod bearing going out and need to rebuild the motor.

I am convinced that I can pull the power out of the 3.8 with a proper build up so the motor swap is now off the table.

As far as the AR setup I don't think that would answer my immediate concern which is a motor going bad.

By the way how long do you think the motor would hold up to an AR setup with a rod bearing going?

Thanks for all the advice guys,
lets keep these bad birds rolling.
Jim
 
Micah,
I don't want to get into a contest with you here. I've seen the AR in action, and there are a few things that you're missing on. Remember that even though Dave D. was getting 294 RWHP on the AR and a few other mods, he did it at 4200 rpm...and then ran out of fuel. First off, you need 50 lb injectors minimum. Ask Julian Miller why... 42s just don't cut it, even on an otherwise stock engine. Last time I checked, it was around $500 for an exhaust, and that's getting a deal. I wouldn't run the AR with anything less than a full exhaust behind the manifolds. MAF is a must as is a better IC. Even though the AR is more efficient than the M90, it still requires an IC. And it better be better than stock because of the amount of air passing through it. So lets go back to the math boards and see what we're up to now...

Base price for the AR: $3200
MAF: $180
50lb Injectors: $300
Fuel Pump: $130
Exhaust: $500
Double IC: $450
SCP Chip: $300
Dyno time for a tune: $100

That adds up to $5160 plus tax where applicable. Even knocking the IC off it's still $4710, close enough to call it a budget of $5k. If you can get in on some GPs you may get that $5160 down to about $5k, but in order to get power above 4200rpm, that is the MINIMUM that you need to safely run the AR on an otherwise stock SC. Add a TB and you up that by another $240.

I'm not arguing that Coy is the way to go. I'm not, nor would I recommend him to any of my friends. I can get better performance for less locally. I just think that the AR needs to be accurately represented. You very well may be able to get 270 rwhp out of the AR with nothing more than exhaust, but who wants to run out of fuel at 4000 rpm? I've got my rev limiter set at 5500 rpm and wish that I didn't have to. But to keep it safe, that's what I have to do until I get larger injectors.

Like I said Micah, I don't want to step on any toes here. But the truth is that it takes more than just slapping on an AR to make power. If you disagree with me, then that's fine. Better your SC than mine. I'll do it the right way to make power...and if someone asks...(as is the case here) I won't steer them down the wrong path.
 
Thanks for the advice.

Sam,
I am getting a pretty nice bulid up from Aldridge Motorsports out here in Portland. He says he will deliver 350+ RWHP but I want to make sure it is still going to be a high mileage motor as I can't afford to drop $7-8000 bucks evry couple of years. Do you have any advice on internals that I need to be aware of?

Also,
I have a true Borla 2.5" Dual exhaust on thh car and will soon have a complete rebuild. What else do I need to handle a AR Blower system?

Thanks,
Jim
 
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