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Thread: Once again Car and Driver prove once again that they are elitist snobs.

  1. #1
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    Once again Car and Driver prove once again that they are elitist snobs.

    The $67K Z06 kicks the tail off of the Germans and Italians and still ranks 3rd. How do they do that?

    Exerpts from the race track notes "Porsche matches the Corvette" on this corner, the F430 "nearly keep(s) pace with the Z06", the Vette "blows off" both of them on acceleration, was able to "brake later than the others" and it gains "half a second" on the straight". So they compare the other cars to the Corvette on every note but in the end running 1.3 seconds faster than the AWD Porsche is still reason to place it 3rd.

    Let's see, in the objective catagories:

    Price: Z06
    Braking: Z06
    Lap time: Z06
    Cornering: Z06
    Top speed: Z06
    0-150: Z06
    1/4 mile: Z06
    Fuel mileage: Z06
    Interior cruise noise level: Z06

    The only place the Z06 got beat was standing start acceleration (gotta love AWD) and top gear acceleration (gotta love the 50% OD 6th gear).

    Interesting though how the smallest engine got the worst gas mileage and the biggest one got the best.

    Ok, everything else aside, I just can't see how in a search for the "Ultimate Sports Car" performance takes a back seat to comfort and convenience. Wild.
    Quote Originally Posted by Miller View Post
    Ya thats why i tape mine down. People think its bc i dont have a moonroof seal (which is true) but its really to keep my roof from ripping off .
    Email me here.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by XR7 Dave
    Interesting though how the smallest engine got the worst gas mileage and the biggest one got the best.
    Dave,

    Only reason the Z06 gets good gas mileage is because of the .50 6th gear. The Ferrari's gearing is suited to it's engine's powerband. Don't you think the ferrari would get good mileage with the Z06's tranny?

    F430's gearing :

    1st : 3.29
    2nd : 2.16
    3rd : 1.61
    4th : 1.27
    5th : 1.03
    6th : .82

    FDR : 4.30:1

    Z06's gearing :

    1st : 2.66
    2nd : 1.78
    3rd : 1.30
    4th : 1.00
    5th : .75
    6th : .50

    FDR : 3.42

    I LOVE the Z06 but if i had the money i would buy a F430 in a heartbeat. Ferrari's exhaust note gives me an orgasm.

  3. #3
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    I LOVE the Z06 but if i had the money i would buy a F430 in a heartbeat. Ferrari's exhaust note gives me an orgasm.
    Dam your easy... haha

    Seriously though the one difference between an under 100,000 car and an over 100,000 car is refinement. Being I havnt driven all of them I cant say. But numbers arnt everything.

    I can make a fox body stang out handle, outbrake, out accelerate a brand spankin new zo6 vette....But the numbers arnt everything..Ya know
    Doing a JD. Current most HP/TQ per lb of boost, turbo or Supercharged FActory 3.8 SC v6 ford block based. Yahh Buddy
    http://www.sccoa.com/forums/garage_v...vehicle&id=110
    Quote Originally Posted by ricardoa1 View Post
    I love the filter. Its pimp. paper element and 10Mircron filtration, 12" long cause size matters.

  4. #4
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    $100,000 difference in price and a good vew of Z06 tail lights and you guys talk to me about refinement? Ok. They refined themselves right into someone's rear view mirror.

    Truth is the Europeans are embarrassed. Ferrari wouldn't even provide a car for them to test because they knew they would get beaten by the plastic American car. IMO Car and Driver put the Vette last just to keep from pissing off the wrong people. What a joke. Kind of like when the Mustang "beat" the GTO.
    Quote Originally Posted by Miller View Post
    Ya thats why i tape mine down. People think its bc i dont have a moonroof seal (which is true) but its really to keep my roof from ripping off .
    Email me here.

  5. #5
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    What a joke. Kind of like when the Mustang "beat" the GTO.
    Dave thats pretty Ironic..Being the GTO is suppossedly the refined car in that case...And the more expensive one....
    Doing a JD. Current most HP/TQ per lb of boost, turbo or Supercharged FActory 3.8 SC v6 ford block based. Yahh Buddy
    http://www.sccoa.com/forums/garage_v...vehicle&id=110
    Quote Originally Posted by ricardoa1 View Post
    I love the filter. Its pimp. paper element and 10Mircron filtration, 12" long cause size matters.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by XR7 Dave
    $100,000 difference in price and a good vew of Z06 tail lights and you guys talk to me about refinement? Ok. They refined themselves right into someone's rear view mirror.
    If you were driving a Ferrari F430 and a Z06 smoked you. Would you really care that much? Ofcourse not. You're driving a ~~~~ ferrari.

    Ferrari doesn't build vehicles just to go fast. They build them to do everything great.

    While i do like the Z06. It's a ~~~ compared to the ferrari.

    Build quality - Ferrari
    Interior - Ferrari
    Exterior - Ferrari
    Herritage - FERRARI

    Do us all a favor and stop the whole "Brand loyal to american cars" bs.

    Next your going to tell me about how much better the Ford GT is compared to the Enzo.

    EDIT - You want to compare a ferrari to the Z06? Try this one...

    F430 Stradale. 490 horsepower and a 2600lb curb weight. 600lbs less then a production ferrari F430



    Last edited by Blk89TBSC; 07-27-2006 at 12:41 AM.

  7. #7
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    so basically you guys would just buy a car for its name

    answer this:

    would you go to abercrombie and fitch to buy a plain white t-shirt for 50 dollars, or go somewhere elseto buy 3 for 10?


    true numbers arent everything, but withthat price difference, the numbers do mena a lot- the ferrari is a status symbol. only reason people would buy one is to say "look at me im rich". because only the rich can afford one.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackpriceisgod
    so basically you guys would just buy a car for its name
    I buy a car because i like it not because of the name. I won't lie tho. I've always loved ferrari's ever since i was a child and hope someday to be able to afford one.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blk89TBSC
    EDIT - You want to compare a ferrari to the Z06? Try this one...

    F430 Stradale. 490 horsepower and a 2600lb curb weight. 600lbs less then a production ferrari F430

    You forgot to mention the $227,000 price tag on that one. What was your point anyway? At least I had one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Miller View Post
    Ya thats why i tape mine down. People think its bc i dont have a moonroof seal (which is true) but its really to keep my roof from ripping off .
    Email me here.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamonSlowpokeBaumann
    Dave thats pretty Ironic..Being the GTO is suppossedly the refined car in that case...And the more expensive one....
    Nothing ironic about it. The Mustang had already been chosen for awards by the staff. Wouldn't look good if their award winner got beaten by last year's GTO now would it?

    Oh well, at least they do post the numbers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Miller View Post
    Ya thats why i tape mine down. People think its bc i dont have a moonroof seal (which is true) but its really to keep my roof from ripping off .
    Email me here.

  11. #11
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    Build quality?!
    You talk about Ferrari build quality?

    Have you ever seen the paint or interior of an F40? The paint is so thin you can see the carbon fiber right through it and the interior is held together with this ~~~~~~ green glue that's oozing from all the seams. It's garbage, and sure it saves a minimal amount of weight but the overall effect is that it makes the car look like ~~~ when you're actually inside one.

    With most people, they imagine a Ferrari or Lamborghini as being something untouchable and it's such a far off dream we imagine it as being better than it actually is/was. Hence the saying "never meet your childhood heroes".
    See the Lamborghini episode of a BBC show called "TOP GEAR", you can find it on any bittorrent site, and watch the review of the Lambo Countach done by James May.

    I, personally, enjoy having a car that cost less and will embarass more expensive cars. Ideally, I'd like to have a 71' widebody 240Z with a RB26DETT in the thing, and it would kill anything on the road, including GSXR 1000s. And this could be acheived in comfortable, streetable trim. Another fantastic option would be an Elise, which would be substantially smaller but is much newer.

    I don't like Porsche because the engine is in the wrong place, it's supposed to be in either the front or middle of the car, not the back, and I despise the Coxster.

    The Z06 is a fantastic car, hands down, and it is unfortunate that C&D chooses to be biased when their own article clearly points out who the winner was. (see the Hot Lap times of the aforementioned program, Top Gear, the new Z06 edged out quiet a number of cars from the hot lap board). After hearing the exhaust note of one being driven by a racing driver at the Chevy Rev It Up event last weekend, I was floored. I wasn't all that impressed with the regular-~~~ Vette I drove but the Z06 seemed to be an entirely different animal, and I'm all for it.

    I think it is about time that affordable speed was available, and the fact that the z06 beats out the more expensive contenders is a testament to the fact that GM has come a long way since the C5, and finally figured out the Nurburgring is the place to test.

    There is still one thing the Vette has been missing since the ZR1, though, and this is what makes me sad:
    The Vette still has PUSHRODS... Why don't we have a 7.0L Twin-Dual-Cam V8?

    Outside of that, I am very pleased with the new vette and am greatly looking forward to the Blue Devil. Ford, however has been nothing but a disappointment with the ~~~~~~ live axle that the Shelby has been stuck with. Why don't we have IRS in mustangs any more? I'd really love to see the Mustang with a MODERN suspension setup, not the antiquated live axle nonsense it has now.

    Rant over.
    Ghost

  12. #12
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    I don't think watching videos constitutes your personal knowledge. I have personally seen an f40 inside and out. Yes they arent the most luxurious cars, but they werent built for that. Buy a 360 and you will get that. The corvette is pretty much representative of what america is. In your face, powerful, and just enough work put into it to get the job done. That being said chevy doent put too much into luxury and build quality. I have seen some newer models that have a slightly higher standard. But no where near european design. For example what I've read is that the HUD on the vette is in no way accurate.....why bother? Then again all car makes and models cater to their specific groups of people. The z06 is an affordable supercar. It's labeled for a reason, you have to cut corners to make it that way.
    -89 White 5-speed-
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  13. #13
    Wow, I'm not certain I want to get involved in this ... but I will.

    Every once in a while we as Americans decide to poke our head out and take on the Big Guns of Europe. Do we honestly believe as auto manufactures that we are building better more refined automobiles? NO! Do we build the best machine we can just to go out, spank one or two of the Big Guns at a few things then hoot and holler about it? HECK YEAH! We did it with the GT40, the New GT, AC Cobra, the Z06 etc etc right on down the line.

    Don't confuse a Ferrari with a Rolls, because its not, but is a Ferrari nicer then a Z06? Without a doubt YES. Just because something is faster doesn't mean its better, or we would be driving something other then SC's.

    The Europeans have a different way of designing suspensions and chassis that we just do not (be it can not or will not) duplicate. Go look at the spring rates on a BMW and see how well they handle. Here we always want to go UP in spring rates ... that’s not always the proper way to get things done. And most of us realize there is a difference in “works” and “proper”.

    Bottom line the Ferrari is more about Fineness, and the Z06 is more about grabbing your crotch and screaming yeah haw. Which one is better? Honestly, I wouldn’t want to drive a Z06 for more then a short trip. Yes I HAVE driven, modified, and taken a Z06 around a track. I have also taken a few higher end European cars around a race track. As Damon stated, there is more to the way a car goes around a track then its static numbers, and quite frankly, the Europeans have us beat.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarlisleLandOwn
    Wow, I'm not certain I want to get involved in this ... but I will.

    Every once in a while we as Americans decide to poke our head out and take on the Big Guns of Europe. Do we honestly believe as auto manufactures that we are building better more refined automobiles? NO! Do we build the best machine we can just to go out, spank one or two of the Big Guns at a few things then hoot and holler about it? HECK YEAH! We did it with the GT40, the New GT, AC Cobra, the Z06 etc etc right on down the line.

    Don't confuse a Ferrari with a Rolls, because its not, but is a Ferrari nicer then a Z06? Without a doubt YES. Just because something is faster doesn't mean its better, or we would be driving something other then SC's.

    The Europeans have a different way of designing suspensions and chassis that we just do not (be it can not or will not) duplicate. Go look at the spring rates on a BMW and see how well they handle. Here we always want to go UP in spring rates ... that’s not always the proper way to get things done. And most of us realize there is a difference in “works” and “proper”.

    Bottom line the Ferrari is more about Fineness, and the Z06 is more about grabbing your crotch and screaming yeah haw. Which one is better? Honestly, I wouldn’t want to drive a Z06 for more then a short trip. Yes I HAVE driven, modified, and taken a Z06 around a track. I have also taken a few higher end European cars around a race track. As Damon stated, there is more to the way a car goes around a track then its static numbers, and quite frankly, the Europeans have us beat.
    Removed by Admin


  15. #15
    Thanks for calling me an ~~~~~~~ there tracy, not everyone here knows that yet; though sometimes we all have to wake up and realise what the truth is.

    Be it about cars, or personallity.

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